Oy. My thoughts have been wandering to some rather inappropriate places. Couldn't really daven on Shabbos because my thoughts were in the gutter. And even worse, I feared that saying shemone esrey with such thoughts would only give those thoughts some strength in some other realms, and might give the YH some strength that he's "got me under his spell" Ch'v.

I am wondering (mostly to myself, once again), what's wrong with a little 24 hour break to get it out of my system. Not because it's so strong and overpowering and all that. No! Verkehrt! It's that the urge is so stupid and not worth it and beneath a yid's dignity that it's simply feeling nice to just "take out the trash" and then leave it out there. But yes, I'd have to accompany the trash MYSELF (at least, for a few hours...) to get it out to the curb and stop smelling up the house.

Yeah, I know: a hundred's not enough and one is too much. blah blah blah. All the AA aphorisms in the world ain't gonna help when my mind is wandering to places that might not even be LEGAL (gulp) and my body parts are acting rather insistently and... I'm trying to remember why this all used to feel so important in the first place :-<  .

I'm rambling, but I think you've ALL been here and probably all done that, too. Anyone got any t-shirts to share? I'm weakening. Thanks.

Forget what everyone else has to say - read through your own post and tell us where the stinking thinking is coming in to play.

silentbattle wrote on 12 Dec 2010 07:00:
Eww. Read my OWN posts? Yuk. They're long and sick and soppy and .... My closest excuse to an insight -- HKB'H always seems to send some sign through my own kids (zera) when I start messing around on the theme of m*n (zera). And they shouldn't have to pay the price of His lessons to ME. So I start to see the value of losing the "outside the box" motivation and simply staying in the 613-sided box, lovingly.

But that rational realization doesn't always cut it when my mind's in the gutter. That's why it's not my own thread that seems to speak to me, but someone else pointing out what I'm convinced I already know, deep inside, somewhere.

I thought the point about reading your own posts is to see how this need for a 24-hour break is a recurring theme and it never seems to work. So maybe its time to turn to plan b. My own feeling is (for what its worth - maybe not much but hey you asked for opinions) is that Plan B should be something along the lines where you put G-d in real control rather than making deals with him. Such as if you send me this sign i'll do this etc. Let's face it He's G-d He knows what we need way better than we ourselves know. If we are going to continue to keep ourselves in charge then we are not going to get the results we need. Just a thought from another addict.

Ouch. You're right. As in, "thanks, I needed that."

If I can only get my wandering mind to join in that very logical view of the world.  Aarrgh.

if you find these thought-type things come and go...can u just distract urself long enough till u don't feel like it anymore?

4 tshirts- how's "I believe in me"...no? how 'bout "starve the beast" hey actually really want a t-shirt w/ that on it that would be so cool...STARVE THE BEAST....AWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooo

...sorry i can't be too much of a help. but im here for you in mind and heart.
keep up the fight, it's so depressing watching someone fall back into ruts that you know they have the strenth.  to have never gotten into in the first place.

as far as my seeking substitutes for genuine pleasure, and settling at the very least for distractions, I present Janis Joplin (a bit of comic relief, which I could use; maybe I'll return and read this later):

"L-rd, won't you buy me a Mercedes Benz
My friends all drive Porsches, I must make amends.
I've worked hard all my life, no help from my friends,
L-rd won't you buy me a Mercedes Benz.

L-rd, won't you buy me a [plasma] TV
[The cast of Survivor] is waiting for me.
I wait for delivery, each day until three
L-rd won't you buy me a [plasma] TV.

L-rd won't you buy me a night on the town
I'm counting on You, L-rd, please don't let me down.
So show that You love me, and buy the next round
L-rd won't you buy me a night on the town.

[song exits with giggles and laughter]

I can talk about t-shirts in this area. Just the last few days as a matter of fact - and it stinks - it set me back ages in my recovery - im all disconnected and my recovery is weak all over. before acting out - it always seems like 'its one hour (or whatever) and thats it then ill be back on track'...

but its not true (in my experience) it has the potential to remove me from the game for a while and makes me weaker and more susceptible to further falls. in other words, it just leaves me wanting more - it never satisfies one off.

please take the heartfelt pleas of a mouse who happens to be wearing that silly t-shirt right now - we value your spiritual 'briut' too much...

Maybe I'm wrong, and I don't mean this to be patronizing, but I think I remember that before your last fall, you were white knuckling and getting tons of chizuk and I'm not sure I've got this right, but would it be fair to say that nothing, at the end of the day helped?

If that's right, then I think what I posted a few posts ago about "nothing helps me" could apply.

I think everybody here's tried everything there is to think of to no avail.  It seems that for us junkies, Hashem is all there is that, at the end of the day, does help/solve our compulsion.

But that's where bitachon comes in.  Because we have to trust Him at the deepest place in the lev where we feel the deepest urge.  That's the sick spot, where we feel our deepest vulnerability, our deepest longing for relief, stimulation, whatever.  So for me it's only when I can beg from that far down in myself that asking for help sometimes seems to come.  And I know when I've understood what He tells me in those moments because I get some kind of deep comfort, relaxation, understanding.  Sometimes it comes with crying.

ps.  The lunchroom scenario was tongue in cheek.  I totally agree with what you said, and probably shouldn't have been joking around about what is serious and important to you.  I'm sorry.

Of course Hashem knows what He's doing, and if a fall is in the works, or if repeated falls are in the works, maybe that's part of your derech.  But His will can be changed with prayer.  My t'shirt is "Prayer is War".  Daven the Amidah and battle that sucker.

yeah, stop fighting and white knuckling for a bissle and come join the chevra in the pub. c'mon, i'll buy you a beer.

1daat wrote on 14 Dec 2010 17:32:

We've tried bitochon, too.  Our own version of it.  And that doesn't work either.

...and then that's when we finally admit defeat, we admit we need more help.  And we join the anonymous 12-step phone conferences (a whole bunch of them just started up yesterday; not too late to join in!).

Doesn't work for everyone, and there may be other paths to recovery, but certainly does work for lots of us, and for me that was enough of a reason to give it a try.

--Eye.

heck yeah, just started the 12-step 2day w/ DC and i'm like to myself "duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuude u serious? why didn't i  do this b4?" some awesome stuff going down in that place. lots of chizuk'll reinforcing yada yada dunno how to explain.

but im thinking, Briut for sure tried 12 step calls already, he's been on the forum for a while now, no?

d_teddybear wrote on 14 Dec 2010 18:23:
Well, no. I haven't done 12 steps in calls, in person, nothin'.

Anyone may PM me for details on why not, since I don't wish to offend, but bottom line is that I still think my best bet is compulsive posting, some good therapy, and a lot of brutal honesty. And so far, this has all taken me further than I would have dreamed. Thanks to the RBSO!!

OK... The barrage of "why not" may now begin....

"compulsive posting" lol

Why is the aim simply going further than you ever dreamed?  Moreover, compulsive posting and the 12-steps are not mutually exclusive.