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Re: I cannot believe I am here 14 Jul 2023 05:53 #398789

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remaininganonymous26 wrote on 14 Jul 2023 02:50:
Thank you all for the wonderful chizuk. I can- and I will- get myself out of this mess. 
There have been two things on my mind today, and I would like to throw them to this choshuve chevra to hear what you all have to say.
First, this is not my first time trying to stop. I have been on GYE for about a year and a half but I was always halfhearted, mainly just tracking my streaks, kind of doing the flight to freedom and occasionally glancing at the forum (without posting). I have always had a good filter, but I never did the personal work which is so necessary. This time I would consider myself fully invested. I noticed most of my streaks in the past were because I was motivated only in the moment- so it lasted 2-3 weeks and then I fell (I think the flight to freedom calls this the pink cloud- short bursts of motivation which soon wanes). How can I avoid that and keep this a serious, longer-lasting journey to 90 days and beyond?
Also, I have been successful for the past few days...and it was really hard! I was wondering will I ever be "normal" again? Will there ever come a time that I no longer need GYE on a daily basis, and I can go through my life without a tremendous challenge multiple times daily? When does it get easier?
Thank you all again for listening, caring, and for sharing your wonderful advice!

You CAN and YOU WILL, with Hashem's help get to a point where it is manageable, where you can have a wonderful, meaningful life, full of Menuchas Hanefesh. We all will have various Nisyonos until 120, but this fight becomes manageable.  Your thinking will become "rewired", you will learn new patterns of acting, of thinking, of being. This will take work, one day at a time, and there will be ups and downs. But read the forums, people's stories,[I personally get tremendous Chizzuk from Vehkam's thread and Gardener of Grodna, check them out]. You will see. They did and you will too.
Friends and mentors will help. We are all here together with you. Together, with Siyata Dishmaya, we can make it.  
Please feel free to reach out anytime at chaim.oigen@gmail.com

Re: I cannot believe I am here 14 Jul 2023 17:49 #398815

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Well said, Reb Chaim. I would say it's hard to answer for you personally, because we don't really know you well, but many, many people have broken free and now live what you would call "normal" lives. They don't find it hard to keep fighting, although there are always nisyoinois of different levels. They don't need GYE on a daily basis, and the fight definitely gets easier. And your story may very possibly end up looking like theirs.
The way I look at it is that the first tekufa here is like D-day. The Allies needed a foothold on continental Europe from where to launch battles against the axis. Enter D-day. The tremendous effort that was invested in it was not that now the war was over, rather that from now we can deal with the enemy from better perspective. 
Many of us are battling for a while with these issues, we have messed up, we have taught ourselves bad habits, we have learned to folloe our animalistic desires. And when we come here we learn to work on ourselves, on changing our perspective on sexual behaviours, and this gives us an even playing field, a way to fight the YH from a healthy place. Yes, we'll keep fighting, but it will be from a place where you'll be fighting like a healthy person does.
As far keeping the steam, connect to people. HHM is a good place to start.
Feel free to say hi. My email is 1gimpelovitz@gmail.com

Re: I cannot believe I am here 16 Jul 2023 03:46 #398840

Thanks for the chizuk!
I am sorry for my ignorance, but what is HHM?

Re: I cannot believe I am here 16 Jul 2023 12:00 #398850

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remaininganonymous26 wrote on 16 Jul 2023 03:46:
Thanks for the chizuk!
I am sorry for my ignorance, but what is HHM?

HashemHelpMe - Someone on the forums who has somewhere between 36 & 48 hours in a day , and dedicates all of it to helping  everyone on the forum. He's helped an unimaginable amount of people here , by giving tips, chizuk and most importantly time, on the phone & in person.

here is his profile link which includes his contact info
guardyoureyes.com/forum/profile/my-profile/userid-15301
May you slide down the banister of happiness and get many splinters of success up your career

Feel free to send me an owl, a howler, or even a Crumple-Horned Snorkack to Iamredfaced@gmail.com


The Red Face
Last Edit: 16 Jul 2023 12:01 by redfaced.

Re: I cannot believe I am here 03 Aug 2023 22:41 #399472

B'H I am going along well in my journey, and hopefully next week I will hit day 30!
If I can ask everyone for some advice- recently, since I have been more careful with guarding my eyes on the computer, I noticed that watching my eyes on the street has been more difficult. Even when I don't take a "second look," I have short fantasies. Usually, I can stop them quickly, but I still feel guilty. This is probably normal for what I am going through, but does anyone have any advice or chizuk? Thank you!

Re: I cannot believe I am here 03 Aug 2023 23:43 #399475

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remaininganonymous26 wrote on 03 Aug 2023 22:41:
B'H I am going along well in my journey, and hopefully next week I will hit day 30!
If I can ask everyone for some advice- recently, since I have been more careful with guarding my eyes on the computer, I noticed that watching my eyes on the street has been more difficult. Even when I don't take a "second look," I have short fantasies. Usually, I can stop them quickly, but I still feel guilty. This is probably normal for what I am going through, but does anyone have any advice or chizuk? Thank you!

This is the YETZER HARA trying his hardes to trip you up when he knows that you are this close to overpowering .
He's Going full nuclear on you.

The good news is that this is only temporary ans youll bezh find that as you move further along  the fantasies start going away

Hatzlocha!
May you slide down the banister of happiness and get many splinters of success up your career

Feel free to send me an owl, a howler, or even a Crumple-Horned Snorkack to Iamredfaced@gmail.com


The Red Face

Re: I cannot believe I am here 04 Aug 2023 17:24 #399495

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remaininganonymous26 wrote on 03 Aug 2023 22:41:
B'H I am going along well in my journey, and hopefully next week I will hit day 30!
If I can ask everyone for some advice- recently, since I have been more careful with guarding my eyes on the computer, I noticed that watching my eyes on the street has been more difficult. Even when I don't take a "second look," I have short fantasies. Usually, I can stop them quickly, but I still feel guilty. This is probably normal for what I am going through, but does anyone have any advice or chizuk? Thank you!

Mazal Tov on being close to a special milestone of 30! Chazak ViAmatz, that is major!

Many people here have written about experiencing the same thing. we become so much more sensitive to inadvertent exposures, and they trigger us more. It seems to be a sign that you are on the right path!! It will get easier, imyH. 

The simple explanation, I think, is that you are becoming more sensitive to what you see. After denying yourself the kind of exposure online that you had become accustomed to, your brain is feeling (temporarily) a greater urge to get the dopamine rush it had become accustomed to. Withdrawal. And as you work and focus on not giving in, on avoiding those experiences, you will experience greater sensitivity to them. They mean more, and have a lot associated with the experience.

On a deeper level - 
A rebbe of mine once told me a very profound thought in the name of one of the great Mashgichim:
"If you squeeze the top of a balloon, the top gets smaller, but the bottom will swell up bigger. The trick is to undo the knot and let a little air out of the balloon at a time. [But not enough that it flies out of your hand and zooms around the room like crazy- my addition]"

When we have developed a desire and need for a negative experience, merely stopping the negative actions will not yet suffice to effect the internal and complete change we are working towards. So internally we still want it, and that drive may come out in a different place.
Merely holding off and counting days doesn't necessarily do it. 
We need to figure out how to "let the air out of the balloon". To make change!
There was a great post from Dov and Cordnoy about this a while ago 
see here 
Not sure if I can paste it right
The first part is Dov
Second is cordnoy, I think.
My comment about how I understood it is last
chaimoigen wrote on 30 Jun 2023 13:16:


'Holding our breath' is a totally different experience than recovery offers. This story illustrates what 'holding breath' is:



The Steipler zt"l was once on guard duty in the Russian or Polish army on Shabbos - and his coat was in a tree, so it would be assur for him to take it down and use it! He decided to stay in place the entire shift without his coat. But it was terribly cold and driving him nuts. How could he stay put?!



He told himself that he could withstand the cold for just a minute (or hour?)...and he did! When that minute was over, he told himself that he just proved that he can tolerate the bitter cold for just a minute. So here before him is: a minute! He then waited a(nother) minute. When it was over, he thought: here before me is another one of those minute-thingies. I can definitely hang on just a minute! So he held on, and tolerated the cold for just a minute.



Etc, etc, and the entire night passed! Amazing. Beautiful.




AND THAT IS NOT AT ALL WHAT 'ONE DAY AT A TIME', MEANS! For what the Steipler did was a gimmick. A mind game. And it worked for him, for one night or day...it may work for more than one day - it may even work for a lifetime, who knows? And if I could stay sober that way for a lifetime, I would probably not take it. It would be gehinnom, would keep me good-and-miserable/crazy, and would generally...suck. I would surely eventually run to lust again just to get out of such a stupid (but kosher!) life. Yup.



But: the Steipler could not have actually held his breath all night using this gimmick. Correct? After a few minutes (about 2-3), a human knows he must breathe, period. So what would you do if someone told you he would give you a million (yep, a million!) bucks if you held your breath for two hours? Would you breath deeply and go give it a try? Silly, of course not. Why suffer for no reason and nothing in the end, anyway?



People who are not sincerely giving up lust for today are just sitting ducks. They are just holding their breath and 'holding back' one day at a time. It does not work. Eventually they will have to breathe. And Hashem knows this. It is a twisting of the meaning of 'one day at a time'.



I know they will say 'vatishlach es amosoh - she sent forth her arm' and all the sweet, encouraging droshos on that. But for an addict, it just does not work here! And in the meantime, the marriage and family are brutalized. Yuch.



[A nasty little digression :pinch:

When B'nei Yisroel (on Rosh chodesh Nissan) went to take the korban Pesach (in four more days!) Hashem writes: "
[i]The point is clear and resonates deeply. I had never "gotten" it  before.
Where were we?
It's truly amazin' that my conversation with Dov today and one we had ten years ago are so similar. Read the follow up posts as well.



End of the nasty little digression. ]

But I doubt that such things will work for most people in the long run - and certainly not for addicts. For when the day comes that they desire it again as strong as ever, they will be 100% convinced again that they can't live without it, period. Back to square one. But surrender one day at a time really does work for alcoholics and others, all over the world.



Surprise!



There is one exception to this idea, and it is an important qualification: There are surely some who do the TapHsiC, or 90-day wall thingy, or counting the days, etc...holding their breath all the way - and it works! Because they did experience abstinence from their prize, after all, and did not die. Amazingly, their penises did not fall off. And abstinence sometimes makes it clear to the person that he does not, in fact, really need it at all!
Therefore, only giving it up in our hearts one day at a time is useful and bears fruit, and that is the 12 step program way - not resisting 'one day at a time'. Get it?



I believe this is true for most ppl who take lots of half-measures and just 'fight it' (but see the exception below).

Sadly, the converse is also true. We all know in our hearts that we cannot hold our breath forever. So, as inspired as we may be to hold our breath and resist getting that sweet orgasm/fantasy/porn joy we need...we are full-aware that we are eventually gonna pop. We have not given it up at all, see it as an eventual necessity, and a masculine right. The only guarantee, then, is that we will need to act out when the maximum tolerance of # days clean is reached. So it is almost as though they are already masturbating, in some respect. By the Korban pesach it means they are given over to G-d and committed to doing His Will - and by lust, it means they are given over to lust and committed to doing nothing real about stopping. So what's the use? May Hashem save me from making this mistake and being in that category, one day at a time.


And Bn"Y went and did as Moshe commanded them." Rashi brings that they went with the intention, knowing that come the 10th of Nissan, they'd take the goat/lamb, and come the 14th, they'd shecht it, etc. In their hearts, it was a done deal. So from right then, Hashem says He considers it that they already did it all!.


Thank you, This point is very clear and responates deeply.
I have never "gotten this" before. I have always only appreciated the value of reducing the struggle to "not today", on a superficial level. Therefore the idea has never fully resonated with me as a fundamental method of healing in and of itself. Because I have always felt that change can't just be about pure behaviour, it also has to be about actually changing. Becoming different. Replacing the hole in your heart and the things that fill it with changes that matter - with new awareness, a new path, new ways of feeling filled and fulfilled, new awareness of Hashem, purpose, etc, etc.  So pushing off the fall for a day, and then another, doesn't really create healing, as Dov is saying. That's why I never loved the idea. [The nasty digression is spot-on, and hurts.] 
Now I think I understand the idea much better. "One Day At A Time" is about real change. But I can reduce the genuine change necessary into day-sized segments. Then it is so much easier to do the work. I can really want to change, to be different, at least for today. If those real changes are being made for today, for now, I can hold on to them. I will then deal tomorrow with holding on to the changes, tomorrow, I will work on being different tomorrow, tomorrow.
I feel the truth in this, I think {and there are divrei Chazal that reflect it} . Thank you

Please feel free to reach out anytime at chaim.oigen@gmail.com
Last Edit: 04 Aug 2023 17:25 by chaimoigen.

Re: I cannot believe I am here 08 Aug 2023 00:25 #399596

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It is normal and expected to start noticing the sights on the street once one has removed himself from the hyper-stimulating screens. The yetzer hara/subconscious wants it's fix, and will do anything to get it. Do not panic. Stay calm. Use the same methods you used to separate yourself from the screen, to now separate yourself from the street. B'ezras Hashem you will learn to ignore the sights that are "attacking" you now. Accept the fact this is part of the process and do your best. The sforim hakedoshim tell us that when one looks away in the street, one is zoiche to have his tefillos answered. Utilize these nisyonos positively. Hatzlacha.
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Re: I cannot believe I am here 31 Aug 2023 01:02 #400684

I made it to about 50 days, and I just had a fall today.
To be honest I have mixed feelings about the fall. Obviously, a fall is disappointing, and as far as I got, I was not able to make it to the full 90 days. I feel bad about myself, and wonder if I can ever break free. I need some chizuk to pick myself up.
On the other hand, part of me is actually happy that I fell. I feel like I am able to recommit myself to my journey, and it is an opportunity to start anew. Before I fell I noticed myself slacking off, and spending time in the "yellow zone," justifying to myself that it is not so bad going on that website. But now that I have fallen, I feel like I have an opportunity to restart, be mechazek, and keep on swinging!
One thing I want to do differently next round is to post my journey every 10 days on this thread. Hopefully, that will help me in my fight.
Any chizuk would be appreciated. Half of me feels like it still needs help and I hope I have the strength to pick myself up and restart!

Re: I cannot believe I am here 31 Aug 2023 01:07 #400685

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If one climbs a mountain for 50 days and falls into a ditch, he has 2 choices. One - to lay down and roll down to the mountain's base.  Two - to enjoy the view and fresh air from 50 days up while bandaging the scrapes.   Which one do you choose?
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Re: I cannot believe I am here 31 Aug 2023 04:07 #400691

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remaininganonymous26 wrote on 31 Aug 2023 01:02:
I made it to about 50 days, and I just had a fall today.
To be honest I have mixed feelings about the fall. Obviously, a fall is disappointing, and as far as I got, I was not able to make it to the full 90 days. I feel bad about myself, and wonder if I can ever break free. I need some chizuk to pick myself up.
On the other hand, part of me is actually happy that I fell. I feel like I am able to recommit myself to my journey, and it is an opportunity to start anew. Before I fell I noticed myself slacking off, and spending time in the "yellow zone," justifying to myself that it is not so bad going on that website. But now that I have fallen, I feel like I have an opportunity to restart, be mechazek, and keep on swinging!
One thing I want to do differently next round is to post my journey every 10 days on this thread. Hopefully, that will help me in my fight.
Any chizuk would be appreciated. Half of me feels like it still needs help and I hope I have the strength to pick myself up and restart!

Sheva yipol tzaddik. Its part of the process. Learn from your mistakes. How can you prevent the "yellow zone" from happening? Where there triggers that could have been dealt with before? But like HHM said, its part of the hike. You are now a different person. If someone would have told you you would be able to get to a state of doing this only five times a year, would you have thought that possible? Prob not. Take it to the next level!
Nothing good grows in the dark. 

Re: I cannot believe I am here 31 Aug 2023 13:16 #400699

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bright wrote on 31 Aug 2023 04:07:

remaininganonymous26 wrote on 31 Aug 2023 01:02:
I made it to about 50 days, and I just had a fall today.
To be honest I have mixed feelings about the fall. Obviously, a fall is disappointing, and as far as I got, I was not able to make it to the full 90 days. I feel bad about myself, and wonder if I can ever break free. I need some chizuk to pick myself up.
On the other hand, part of me is actually happy that I fell. I feel like I am able to recommit myself to my journey, and it is an opportunity to start anew. Before I fell I noticed myself slacking off, and spending time in the "yellow zone," justifying to myself that it is not so bad going on that website. But now that I have fallen, I feel like I have an opportunity to restart, be mechazek, and keep on swinging!
One thing I want to do differently next round is to post my journey every 10 days on this thread. Hopefully, that will help me in my fight.
Any chizuk would be appreciated. Half of me feels like it still needs help and I hope I have the strength to pick myself up and restart!

Sheva yipol tzaddik. Its part of the process. Learn from your mistakes. How can you prevent the "yellow zone" from happening? Where there triggers that could have been dealt with before? But like HHM said, its part of the hike. You are now a different person. If someone would have told you you would be able to get to a state of doing this only five times a year, would you have thought that possible? Prob not. Take it to the next level!

Get up, keep going on. You're a fighter. You're still in the ring, you can win this.
Keep on trucking. You're a good man. 

Just one point to add to all these truths.
Sometimes a person can have a feeling that "let me get the fall over with already and then start fresh". This, too, is a slick trick from that slippery guy.
Contrary to what the Yetzer wants us to believe - you can start fresh even without a fall happening. Sometimes we don't realize what happens until it's too late. And sometimes we realize, even though "still in the yellow zone" that it 'aint great. That's also a great time to start fresh.....    
Please feel free to reach out anytime at chaim.oigen@gmail.com

Re: I cannot believe I am here 31 Aug 2023 17:05 #400713

Thank you everyone for the chizuk! It really helps!
If I can share something that happened yesterday after my fall- I hope this story will inspire others as well.
After I fell, I noticed my yetzer hara telling me the day is ruined, I can start recounting tomorrow, but take advantage now for the rest of the day to continue in the fall and enjoy the tayva! This came with an incredibly powerful urge, something I knew was too powerful for me to withstand and overcome. I had no idea what to do, and soon before I would have given in, I quickly said a taphsic shvua for the rest of the day and the next day. And it worked!!!
I did not fall for the rest of the day, and today so far is going great. This may be the first time in my life I do not feel shame or guilt after a fall, but I am actually really proud of what I did and how I handled the situation! If the yetzer hara had gotten the best of me, I would have pushed off restarting a day...and then another day... and who knows if I would have picked myself up. This was my moment of gevura, where I showed myself who I really am!
What I learned from this experience is that the fall is not me. I made a mistake, but I still have all the tools I learned throughout the journey, and I can pick myself up and continue on. I am not a sinner! I am an aspiring baal tshuva, who is beautiful in the eyes of Hashem, who made a mistake and fell. But I am not defined by my mistake! Onwards to another 50 days and beyond!

Re: I cannot believe I am here 31 Aug 2023 17:08 #400714

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remaininganonymous26 wrote on 31 Aug 2023 17:05:
Thank you everyone for the chizuk! It really helps!
If I can share something that happened yesterday after my fall- I hope this story will inspire others as well.
After I fell, I noticed my yetzer hara telling me the day is ruined, I can start recounting tomorrow, but take advantage now for the rest of the day to continue in the fall and enjoy the tayva! This came with an incredibly powerful urge, something I knew was too powerful for me to withstand and overcome. I had no idea what to do, and soon before I would have given in, I quickly said a taphsic shvua for the rest of the day and the next day. And it worked!!!
I did not fall for the rest of the day, and today so far is going great. This may be the first time in my life I do not feel shame or guilt after a fall, but I am actually really proud of what I did and how I handled the situation! If the yetzer hara had gotten the best of me, I would have pushed off restarting a day...and then another day... and who knows if I would have picked myself up. This was my moment of gevura, where I showed myself who I really am!
What I learned from this experience is that the fall is not me. I made a mistake, but I still have all the tools I learned throughout the journey, and I can pick myself up and continue on. I am not a sinner! I am an aspiring baal tshuva, who is beautiful in the eyes of Hashem, who made a mistake and fell. But I am not defined by my mistake! Onwards to another 50 days and beyond!

Well done!
Thats the perfect way to fall gracefully & get right back up!
KOT!
May you slide down the banister of happiness and get many splinters of success up your career

Feel free to send me an owl, a howler, or even a Crumple-Horned Snorkack to Iamredfaced@gmail.com


The Red Face

Re: I cannot believe I am here 31 Aug 2023 18:23 #400717

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remaininganonymous26 wrote on 31 Aug 2023 17:05:
Thank you everyone for the chizuk! It really helps!
If I can share something that happened yesterday after my fall- I hope this story will inspire others as well.
After I fell, I noticed my yetzer hara telling me the day is ruined, I can start recounting tomorrow, but take advantage now for the rest of the day to continue in the fall and enjoy the tayva! This came with an incredibly powerful urge, something I knew was too powerful for me to withstand and overcome. I had no idea what to do, and soon before I would have given in, I quickly said a taphsic shvua for the rest of the day and the next day. And it worked!!!
I did not fall for the rest of the day, and today so far is going great. This may be the first time in my life I do not feel shame or guilt after a fall, but I am actually really proud of what I did and how I handled the situation! If the yetzer hara had gotten the best of me, I would have pushed off restarting a day...and then another day... and who knows if I would have picked myself up. This was my moment of gevura, where I showed myself who I really am!
What I learned from this experience is that the fall is not me. I made a mistake, but I still have all the tools I learned throughout the journey, and I can pick myself up and continue on. I am not a sinner! I am an aspiring baal tshuva, who is beautiful in the eyes of Hashem, who made a mistake and fell. But I am not defined by my mistake! Onwards to another 50 days and beyond!

Amazing! After a fall we actually have an amazing oppurtunity. To build up our muscles in a unique area. Recovering from falls. This muscle is very important as we will fall in many areas in our life. We are always growing and working on new things. If we build up our resilience this can help us in every area. And in my humble opinion it is what Hashem wants from us to work on after a fall! Great job!
Nothing good grows in the dark. 
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