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TOPIC: HELP-SOS 33649 Views

Re: HELP-SOS 09 May 2011 08:35 #105489

  • ben durdayah
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Tzaddik, Tayere Chaver Avi,

You've lost me here.

IMHO, there's no stirah whatsoever between surrender and shmiras ha'eyneyim.

However, the difference in pre step 1 shmiras ha'eyneyim and post step 1 shmiras ha'eyneyim is that whereas before step 1 one is motivated by the desire to be a member of G-d's holy commando and/or the feeling that "OMG! How can such a person like me even be tempted to stare at...?", i.e. yeshus and ga'avah or lachatz driven melancholy OCD...

After step 1 (or in the midst of working on it) one practices shmiras ha'eyneyim by turning to himself and Hashem when tempted and telling himself and Hashem:

I. Am. Totally. Powerless. Against. Lust. I. Really. Really. Really. Really. Want. To. Gawk/Stare/Leer/You Fill In The Blank. at X,Y, or Z, that isn't mine to be had, and that turns me on in a major way. For some sick reason, I enjoy teasing myself with such Sights/Thoughts/You fill in the blank. Even though this is not good for me, as indulging in such things is lethal, i.e. -makes my life a living hell. Although I know the truth of the matter, my Body/Nefesh HaBehamis/Brain/You fill in the blank is convinced that ONLY indulging in this totally self-destructive behavior will Satisfy/Calm/You fill in the blank my Craving/Shot Nerves/You fill in the blank.

I am totally powerless. Therefore, despite all the shmay dray as above, I will be your shmatte RBSO, because I cannot afford even just that first look. Please help me Hashem, because I have come to realize that only You can, as I have realized that I haven't the foggiest clue as how to manage the wonderful gift of life that you have given me. Therefore, for the sake of my mental health, I am trying to engrave these thoughts into my head as a screensaver-less computer monitor absorbs the image left on it for too long. I will simply not look. I cannot look. Sorry for failing G-d's helige Kedusha Commando, but suicide is a much bigger aveirah, even though I do not care which particular lav it is.

KOT Tzaddik!

E
For Dov and the other two guys who care,
My real name really is
 Eli
Like the original Bendy, Ein hadavar talui ela bee




 
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Re: HELP-SOS 09 May 2011 14:12 #105500

  • ZemirosShabbos
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rebbe EBD, that was a great post!
thanks
i enjoyed it almost as much as bike-riding from Talpiot to Neve Yakov
Sometimes life is like tuna with not enough mayonaise
~Inna beshem ZS

Give, Forgive
~Cordnoy

The reason I'm acting as if I'm pregnant, is because I'm expecting. I should be accepting.
~TZ
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Re: HELP-SOS 09 May 2011 16:22 #105508

  • tzaddik90
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Dear friends,
I now have some perspective to unfurl somethings.
Briefly,
I started SA. I went strong, sober 50 days. Not just that, my sponsor said he'd almost never seen someone understand and relate to the 4th 5th steps as quick as i. And then last week i fell. badly. for two-three days. Thank God. People do the meetings or GYE and remain sober sometimes for even two years, and then fall. Why? So today i met sponsor in the rova. He said it happenned because, of course, i didnt work the program. Specifically, i had moved past step oneand hadn't internalized it enough that i began to live with it like a tatoo.

so, like the white book says, i got sane, and better. and then forgot i have this mental obsession, insane urge. and then i, of course, was no longer in ''program'', slipped, didnt call my calls (ARYEH TAHOR/POSTAL/BB!) and then fell.
I wanted to believe id join SA and never fall again. Thsnk God i did fall, now. I dont want to relapse for 5 years like others. I want to make mistakes now and learn from them now.

If not for the fact that we had a 5th step meeting last week i never would have told people i fell 3 times. my sponsor didnt answer the phone, i didnt leave it on his message machine, and didnt admit it on a phonecall.
sponsor said i should call at least 25 people the next time i want to act out. He said last time he felt that, he actually called 23. He is real. This goy knows he's sick. really sick. And uses it to do program all the time.


Next, sponsor and i were supposed to move onto 2nd step, but he said he asked a sheilah to the famous Mike C of chicago. Mike C paskined that if someone falls, even after many days of sobriety, you cannot do any step other than one for at least thirty days. He said this is because the sponsee (me) still has too much lust and muck craziness ruach shtusskeit in his head to really be able to DO any step after one. So now he (I) has to wait until the druggs clear out of his system.
Then sponsor said: They say in AA, ''i may have one slip left, but i may not have one recovery left''.
All it takes is one stupid error to ruin your life and or s/one else's. because we are really sick. a real illness. so you may be a few steps away from ruin, but my sponsor and i are not. we speak for ourselves. that is our reality. our phisiological reality-yona pollack.
i sat in doctor toast a few days back, eating lechem shum and pesto. and i saw ''sheeirutei beit hasohar'', two jail trucks drive by.

You know what a jail truck is? it trasports people like they move cows. You know who those pople are? people who need to be locked up, because they have no self control. They blew it. game over. like 12 and 12 says, their score cards now read zero.
I dont want to be in jail. I dont want to lose forever. i dont want to learn to hard compulsively again and wind up like the chofetz chaim who couldnt learn for a year, see r' yoshor's artscroll book. i dont want insanity.

i want soundness of mind. and freedom from my hatred, lust, ego, fears, resentment, self ritcheousness, taking, fantasy, isolation.

freedom-if i only let go now, i can begin the process to be free later. every drink i take in through my eyes or in my mind moves me worse, into oblivion, and maybe i wont have another recovery. i may have one last slip, but not one last recovery, god forbid. i dont want to know.

another point from the xstian/jewish sa knessiah ktanah today in the rova:
sponsor said he argued with others in SA what sobriety means (this is absurd bec. its really clear in end of white book, eyin sham), and guess what-my xstian filthy crusading goy rat of a sponsor holds that sobriety is exactly the torah definition. people, and i, used to think that GYE and SA have sep. gdarim for sobriety. on GYE you cant look at p*** and in SA you can.

So goy crusader priest sponsor says he found that if we even dont do shmiras einayim, we wont be sober. he is sober 18 years, and the ''i can put whiskey on my lips but not drink'' doest work, never freed anyone from lust, and didnt lead to real freedom from all bad middos, later steps. He even had a guy in program who argued with him, and the guy even ''eeparone-etrated a whoa!man'', but didnt have an orgaNIsm, and the guy considered himself sober.

is that crazy!!!

the white book say that sobriety is...'progressive victory over lust'. if i was clean 50 days, and fell, its cause i stopped progressing. true.
my mistake was i thought SA wants me to dedicate my whole life to not having sex with one's self. wrong. so i got worse in other things leading up to... and then fell. because i wasnt doing progressive vicory over lust. if im not becoming more kadosh, im getting worse, and maybe just suppressing if not falling. but fall or not, that guy is an ego trip, so he's a creep either way. either way he's a loser in real life.
my mistake was this. alos, my mistake was that i thought my lust came from these feelings of resentment and anxiety, etc. so i worked on these other things. wrong. really, said sponsor and experience, i will always be vulnerable to lust. you dont like me anymore because of that? sorry. its my cheilek from hashem. now, in addition to lust i also have ots of bad middos to work on that directly make life unmanagable and push druggs like lust.

i am not saying i can never be kdosh. i can. see tanya chapter 13-14-015-16.
i can, was, and will be, iyH. but i will also always be vulnerable. the gye handbook has a mashal that mamesh is real life for my wife. she has thyroid, and it is serious, but all she has to do is take her same pill every day the rest of her life. my mind does not need to be filled with bad stuff. god forbid. but i will always be vulnerable, and that is the pshat of once an addict always anaddict.

tam vinishlam in the sfardi shul bisheim borey olam, bichasot pepsi cola
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Re: HELP-SOS 09 May 2011 16:26 #105509

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ebd, just saw ur post for 9 seconds. i meant that surrender means letting go of my right to lust and do what i want as my being god.
shmiras einayim can and should be this.
however, a more common shmiras einayim, discussed in tanya 16, is that even though i want to do this, i wont cuz the halacha says no. that is not surrender, its suppression, thats what i meant

just because you dont dribble saliva and chocolate syrup in your beard like i do doesnt mean you could just ____ like that.
kot and surrender! sally salamander
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Re: HELP-SOS 09 May 2011 16:30 #105512

  • tzaddik90
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wow, i read your post, ebd
took the words right outta my beard
''thats what i meant'' (famous cop out)

nice post! that means that this real life changing info is....IN YOUR HEAD! what a step! i too am just getting this into my head, shkoiach reb shmlonoyach
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Re: HELP-SOS 09 May 2011 16:36 #105513

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one more lesson from crusader last supper sponsor-one day at a time.
my world record of sobriety is that i am sober just today. one day at a time

i received an email from a prominent hero member of this website, which says:
HAKUNA MATATA

what a wonderful phrase, it means tikkun hayesod for the rest of your days,
it's our lust free philosofyyyyyy, hakuna matata

to the tune of bar yochai

zem, how can i go a day without...

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Re: HELP-SOS 09 May 2011 17:43 #105516

  • heuni memass
Thanx man- I learned so much from your meeting..... Now I need to start chewing it. 

BTW-I always wonders what all those people are doing in the Rova..
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Re: HELP-SOS 09 May 2011 17:49 #105518

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tzaddik90/Special Weapons And Tactics wrote on 09 May 2011 16:36:

HAKUNA MATATA
it's our lust free philosofyyyyyy,

heuni memass wrote on 09 May 2011 17:43:

Thanx man- I learned so much from your meeting..... Now I need to start chewing it. 

tzadik, you are gonna get rich
selling the original, home-brewed, organic, non-gebrokts
mustard-flavored HAKUNA MATATA chewing gum
with a glossy collectible card with pictures of various GYE people (all wearing paper bags over their heads)
cha-ching!
Sometimes life is like tuna with not enough mayonaise
~Inna beshem ZS

Give, Forgive
~Cordnoy

The reason I'm acting as if I'm pregnant, is because I'm expecting. I should be accepting.
~TZ
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Re: HELP-SOS 10 May 2011 05:15 #105554

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ben durdayah wrote on 09 May 2011 08:35:

Tzaddik, Tayere Chaver Avi,

You've lost me here.

IMHO, there's no stirah whatsoever between surrender and shmiras ha'eyneyim.

However, the difference in pre step 1 shmiras ha'eyneyim and post step 1 shmiras ha'eyneyim is that whereas before step 1 one is motivated by the desire to be a member of G-d's holy commando and/or the feeling that "OMG! How can such a person like me even be tempted to stare at...?", i.e. yeshus and ga'avah or lachatz driven melancholy OCD...

After step 1 (or in the midst of working on it) one practices shmiras ha'eyneyim by turning to himself and Hashem when tempted and telling himself and Hashem:

I. Am. Totally. Powerless. Against. Lust. I. Really. Really. Really. Really. Want. To. Gawk/Stare/Leer/You Fill In The Blank. at X,Y, or Z, that isn't mine to be had, and that turns me on in a major way. For some sick reason, I enjoy teasing myself with such Sights/Thoughts/You fill in the blank. Even though this is not good for me, as indulging in such things is lethal, i.e. -makes my life a living hell. Although I know the truth of the matter, my Body/Nefesh HaBehamis/Brain/You fill in the blank is convinced that ONLY indulging in this totally self-destructive behavior will Satisfy/Calm/You fill in the blank my Craving/Shot Nerves/You fill in the blank.

I am totally powerless. Therefore, despite all the shmay dray as above, I will be your shmatte RBSO, because I cannot afford even just that first look. Please help me Hashem, because I have come to realize that only You can, as I have realized that I haven't the foggiest clue as how to manage the wonderful gift of life that you have given me. Therefore, for the sake of my mental health, I am trying to engrave these thoughts into my head as a screensaver-less computer monitor absorbs the image left on it for too long. I will simply not look. I cannot look. Sorry for failing G-d's helige Kedusha Commando, but suicide is a much bigger aveirah, even though I do not care which particular lav it is.

KOT Tzaddik!

E



Ben Durdaya, that post was inspirational/informative/to the point/last edited by Kedusha on May 08, 2011, 17:36:02/you fill in the blank
The Blind Beggar is a character in Rebbe Nachman's story of the Seven Beggars.
If I view a woman as an object, I am powerless over lust, but I don't have to look.
I can guard my eyes.
I want to guard my eyes.
I do guard my eyes.
Why do I say these four lines?
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Re: HELP-SOS 10 May 2011 05:43 #105557

  • tzaddik90
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are u...?
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Re: HELP-SOS 10 May 2011 15:57 #105570

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an email to a big herring here on GYE, from today:


dear cauliflower international (name changed),

this healing is not easy. im following _____'s orders with wife and
it is like ruach hakodesh, with 100% successful results.

but this healing is so hard. to work on my middos, that's simple.

i trained myself to care about that for years, through torah/mussar.

to work on kdusha, ive also cared about that my whole life. i always
had a ''program'' for this stuff, before i knew gye. it didnt work so
well, but i cared.

but now i have to admit that i am sick and am a sexaholic and
workaholic, i have a real illness, and have lost my mind and bechira
in two of the hundreds of parts of my life. that is new. hard.
unbelievable.

i knew this 5 months ago. but it was not in my heart, only in my mind.
and my ''cared'' was more quantity then, not deep quality.

so i have already proven this to myself, i shared with you some
details once, but now i have to stare it in the face and live it.

until now, i tried to just do ''ratzon HAShem'', and just fall when
convenient and just do tshuva afterwards. or i'd work too hard until
insanity, take a big break from everything in life, and start anew.

i want soooo much to just stick to that mihalech, it is so EASY.

so im on the right track, finally on the first foot of the path, but
it is so hard.

like campers who ask to go on an  exciting hike up the mountain, but
jokingly all complain and groan to one another as they and counselor
make their way up to the top, around thorns, hopping rocks, going
through water, panting, sweating, trying to keep up, getting tired,
scratched.

thanks for listening. just wanted to touch base really about the wife
thing. im sure you anyways know, but wife and i have a great marriage=we
are both young and have lots of things to work on, but we both are
semi-honest and make up all the time applicable.

wev'e both hurt each other, sometimes real bad, but we are again on
the right track, and these are god's growing pains.

i know now i am manipulative, self centered, angry, resentful, i need
god and nothing else. i know it makes me sound like hitler ymshm, but
its really just exposure of the yetzer harah deep inside the ''nice
guy'' that my wife and others consider me.

thanks for listening.
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Re: HELP-SOS 10 May 2011 17:55 #105587

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Your search for inner truth is leading you down some painful paths right now. B'EZRAS Hashem,  you and your wife will come out on top of the mountain, and as you admire the view and clear, unpolluted air up there, you will look back down at the slippery and spiral path which brought you to the summit, and you will say "it was worth it". Very worth it.
B'EZRAS Hashem.
Hashem is addicted to you! Feel His hugs!"Sheva yipol tzaddik VKUM"
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Re: HELP-SOS 11 May 2011 16:26 #105682

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withdrawal

what a word.

ever watch a western where they say "draw!" and blow each others brains out?

so to withdraw seemingly is to put the gun away

i read about withdrawal in the white book, in the beginning there.

i didn't chap what it was.

oh, how i do now, oh i really do...
____
here's my new experience.

i never gave such a serious shot at exposing my character defects and never in my life did i put away my druggs like i do today.

so if i lived off of ego and lust as my friends, lovers, consolers, and masters,
and i suddenly give them up, what does that leave me? starving, naked of my old security.

i am today for the first time on this level like a turtle without a shell.

((i once saw my friends getting in a van to go to keystone up in the rockies. i was wearing these punky three quarter shorts and not nearly dressed to go up to the snowy mountains; but i jumped in the storage compartment and came along.
i went tubing with them, went on the lifts...but i was darn cold!!! ))

i hardwired my brain to run a certain way for 26 years, and now i rebooted the system, so what do you think? i need a new operating system now! and i dont really have one yet. sure, i have a new system on a disk in a box in my house, but i didnt install it yet

so my computer of brain is kinda blank now. that's withdrawal.

this is the best mashal i have now-
it's like you were cornered behind some rock in battle, seperated from your army unit.
your army friends are on the other side of the field.
each time you peek your head out from the rock, the enemy snipers take potshots at your head.

but you realize....the only way for me to be truly safe and secure is to leave this shelter, run across the field while they shoot at me, and rejoin my unit

you gotta leave your shelter to get better.

after a fierce bout of unhapiness and toil the last few days, i worte to Dov, and while he was getting a prophetic vision (atzilus refracted through yetzirah, vilo kum kimoshe o'd) he replied:

"You have come a long way. Do not see thses struggles as new things going wrong. I believe these difficulties are expressions of layers of the same blockages that are getting taken out of your way in the right time. You are allowing it to happen, b"H."

exactly

thank you dov.

i spoke to a real all star GYE today, he doesn't really post so much, but
he is a living specimen of growth in SA

so i said ******, what should i do? theyr'e just sniping me as i run to the other side of this field?

he said "the white book says just withdraw surrender, withdraw more, surrender, and keep doing this till you get to the other side, it'll happen kid, just run and dont turn back!!!"

so guys, im running now for my life to the other side of this field! it is so exhilirating, i am running to somewhere!

run forest! run run run! don"t turn back!







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Re: HELP-SOS 11 May 2011 16:35 #105684

  • heuni memass
My Man..  I feel powerless when i watch your fight. 

I will watch you in silence.

Keep on posting - I am watching very closely as my allies are closing in.

---hm
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Re: HELP-SOS 11 May 2011 16:50 #105690

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heuni memass wrote on 11 May 2011 16:35:

My Man..  I feel powerless when i watch your fight. 

I will watch you in silence.

Keep on posting - I am watching very closely as my allies are closing in.

---hm
Don't be fooled. He is not fighting - except to learn how to let go and let Hashem take care of what he always selfishly considered his own, private, huge problem.

And no one else's success can ever hurt you in any way, so keep watching....
"Off the 18-wheeler and fine on this tricycle!", "I do not particularly care exactly which "lav" suicide is. I'm not interested in it for other reasons...and you are probably the same."
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