proudyungerman wrote on 03 Jul 2024 20:58:

The unique gadlus of this move was one chaver in the yeshiva sharing his experience with people in the same situation, and offering to be of help. If I was in BMG, I would've called. 

But to strew ads in the lakewood scoop would not have the same effect. Though I'm sure it would get more responses than the standard GYE ad (assuming they'll publish it). 

So someone in the Mir could duplicate this. And each individual could perhaps duplicate it in their shul (if they're comfortable). But it requires individuals duplicating it in their community, and not there are very few IWLR's out there willing to do that. You can hang up signs like this in Burma, but I ain't hanging up signs like this in the local shuls. 

But I do hear that it's a lot more repeatable than I thought at first.

I don't want to be the negative nancy (discouraging david? shooting down shem?) on this thread so let me be a little more positive. Go for it! We can do it! Rah!

@IWLR - you are a hero! And the words in your letter are perfect for many of those suffering!

A couple relevant things from my experience in EY - 
there is an organization that puts up stickers all over with phone numbers to call for help with shmiras habris.. and people try to rip them down or rip out the numbers. I spoke to a mechanech/father and he said that the "organization" is not ok. They tell ppl to give thousands of shekel to tzedaka or whatever. Not sure, but my point is - when it is a personal letter from someone at YOUR yeshiva, it says I learn here in BMG etc. it sounds much better than from an anonymous organization of no repute. So not so easy just to put these signs all over, needs to be thought out carefully.

There is an organization that has the backing of all the gedolim called Lev Shomea. They are a hotline and bachurim, avreichim, rebbeim, roshei yeshiva, fathers can call in to get advice, reassurance, guidance etc. They asked a lot of Roshei Yeshiva about speaking out about these inyanim to the bachurim, and about dealing with bachurim who reach out to them. The general consensus is: we don't talk about such things, they should call Lev Shomea (the number is *8147 )

So making a hotline should be awesome! It would need to be something that people feel is ok hashkafically and comfortable to talk to, and consider that there is a wide swath of people dealing with this challenge...

Let's create change!

And maybe if you write on the letter - with the haskama of the RY ... etc. that would help avoid people from ripping them down?

For this, we can utilize some great Jewish marketing guys. Maybe put the handwritten notes on the margin of a sign for a parlor meeting or auto mall advert? Or a picture of a huge home in TR with a pool...

Or maybe write on top - "Please do not rip down this sign"

this was circulated in israel [though not in the mir yet]

If someone has the courage to actually go get the haskoma of the R"Y... than it can maybe go in the locked glass bulleting board.
I can picture the crowds around it writing the phone number down on any available scrap of paper

I would feel more comfortable in putting signs up if a Da'as tora would second the idea
[I can understand that it can have 'side effects' and therefore although a big help to many, perhaps inappropriate for others and at times shev val taasa odif]
Who is the Daas Tora of GYE? What do they say?

GYE sent us a flyer a short while ago when they started their advertising campaign and told us that we can hang it up in our shul if we want. We can ask GYE whether they still agree to this. I would only say to do so in a shul or kollel where the rav doesn't mind the sign or at least that you know that he won't be upset at you for hanging it up.

I am not for an anonymous person hanging up a sign that he is offering anonymous help. Although you know that you are safe, someone reading the sign, including myself, would assume that it is an unqualified person trying to offer advice, and would take the sign down. BMG or the people in BMG were right for taking down the signs, regardless of their general policy of whether this topic should be written openly to the public.

GYE has a teens division and even if a teen sees the sign he is safe. If GYE were concerned about exposing every teen to a sign of GYE I don't think they would be advertising everywhere. I don't think it would be proper to hang up a sign in a Mesivta. The magidei shiur and staff should be educated about GYE teens, and send someone there if he deems it appropriate.

Though I don’t have much to add to this conversation, I just want to check in to express my awe, respect, and love for what IWLR has done and is doing. To see this unshakable, tenacious drive to help is heartwarming.

General IWLR, please give me marching orders if there’s something you want me to do to assist you in your holy work!

Muttel

I'm enjoying the image of someone going around BMG like mission impossible, secretly hanging up signs and slipping back into the shadows. 
Rip down one sign, two more shall take its place. Hail GYE.

redfaced wrote on 03 Jul 2024 23:21:

If there are crowds there, not sure anyone is writing down the number.... I'm imagining 100 people come back at night to copy the number down thinking they're the only one, only to discover 100 people there..... they all start crying/laughing, all agree to be mechazek each other and reach out to IWLR!

Well, maybe not exactly, but the imagery is encouraging....

KOMT!!!!!!!!!!!!

Muttel

WOW!!! Rabboisai, keep k'nocking the posts! 

Reb IWLR, I'm so glad you finally posted about your signs. The world should know about the gibborei ko'ach that we have here!!! 
The plain truth is that the whole idea of a hotline was inspired by what IWLR has done. Except how many people can be helped this way? If we set up a system of sorts, where we have a list of possible mentors, we can hopefully reach and help many more people

1) Definitely, the plan would be for it to be clear that anyone calling would be speaking to a like-minded ben Torah who has been through similar struggles. When I spoke to the people you sent my way that was the first 10 minutes; I shared my story and what GYE (read, HHM and the GYE chevra) have done for me. Then we get down to business

2) It would definitely have to be under the constant guidance of HHM, with even the guys here that can do it getting some training. Hey, the man is bored anyway, so why not?

3)Reb CMS, I know. I'm the impossible optimist. as I pointed out, this had been done. The ma'ale here of having people that have been there, that have helped others here or in their yeshiva, it just cannot be overstated. I think there are more than 3 people that are able to help the average struggling guy. And we could create a system to ensure that people are not biting off more than they can chew. 

4) I don't think this is any way limited to BMG. Ads in shuls, periodicals, etc. could be put anywhere, and I would hope for at least one thing. That the people reading them know that they are not alone and there's a way out

Reb IWLR, I'd point out one thing about your gevaldige sign that has possibly bothered the chassid sh*te
You wrote in the sign that many bnei Torah are struggling. 
Now, of course, it's the plain and simple truth. But that guy either was very offended, or struggles himself.
Either way, I'd be curious if you would hang up a sign without those words if they stayed up a few minutes longer

Friends, it's so wonderful to be here!!!

Interesting that I just got an email from GYE that they are looking for mentors and are offering training....

@eerie, have you spoken to GYE leadership to get their help? 

Just askin'
Muttel

Muttel wrote on 04 Jul 2024 16:29:

Good question.

R' Eerie GYE has the money, infrastructure, experience, haskamos etc. Obviously they have their own advertising approach. But did they say anything about your proposals?

Just hung up with person-who-called-from-the-sign-38. 
I asked him what he thought about such a phone line. He echoed what IWLR said
1) For bnei Torah like himself, it would have to be clear that the caller would be speaking to a ben Torah
2) The possibility of remaining anonymous (this guy isn't anymore), plus speaking to people that you know have helpful ideas would be a powerful pull

Friends, we gotta make it happen

chosemyshem wrote on 04 Jul 2024 16:41:

I have spoken to some, not enough. And not about this idea. No, that email had nothing to do with me, it's just Hashem doing his thing
Although the eternal reward for our collective sobriety goes to GYE and it's staff, I would feel very strongly that this line should not be an official branch of GYE. For two reasons. One is that the bnei Torah should see it as more of a bnei Torah helping bnei Torah thing, not an organization.
I have mentioned the other idea, sort of. I had suggested that whenever GYE people go to rabbanim, they should call one of us to go down with them and tell the rav what he experienced, what GYE is like etc. And thus hammer home the idea that they should be recommending this to others. It seems they rarely meet rabbanim, and the logistics would slow down their fundraising efforts, making it not so feasible. Thought he agreed to the concept and its power, and encouraged me to encourage the oilam to reach out on their own (or with another friend or five) to rabbanim, RYs, etc. that we can, and tell them all about it.

BTW, GYE doesn't have unlimited money and manpower. They cannot do everything. And they don't have to
We gotta remember, it's not GYE's achrayus to share with klal Yisroel. It's ours!