hello everybody, it's Lavi.
most of you don't know me, and it probably wouldn't help you either.
i was active on gye around a year ago, and since then i only pop in here and there.
my self diagnoses was a mild! addiction to lust and more strong addiction to movies,
i have chatted to a few vip's from this site, who have opened my eyes about the true nature of addiction. nevertheless i am not your typical addict, and it may well be that my problem is only borderline addiction, and in any event , i don't claim to understand a lot of people here.

i am writing to express my own feelings on recovery, which i have b'h made some headway, i had a few months clean, and weeks here and there.

a small disclaimer; i realize what i am going to write will NOT resonate with a lot of people and is possibly against mainstream recovery.
the idea of serenity/stability/recovery, being the most important thing in the world, doesn't work for me. i need it to be a religious issue, or it doesn't matter so much to me. life is only as valueable as my connection with Hashem.
i do however realize the importance of removing undue pressure in recovery, but for me i find it helpful to realize that the more i remove myself from shmutz, the more i can connect to Hashem. which is the ultimate goal for me.

Same here - I have it as a religious issue also, although there's also a little birdy that tells me not to lust cos I may get arrested or lose my family or what not c"v...

lavi, the white book talks all about the connection to God with which we are missin'
recovery is about findin' Him again.
Addiction is lookin' for that union.

but we were lookin' for love in all the wrong places.

bhatzlachah

I agree with the above post from cordnoy.

Welcome lavi glad to hear you are making a headway .

Keep up the good work.

I can understand why connection to Hashem and religious is an integral part of your recovery. At the same time I have found that unfortunately oftentimes it can only take us so far. As Many others have put it, our issue is so much more complex than any one facet of our personality. No rational no matter how potent can affectively solve our problem even if know it's wrong, bad etc.

Keepclimbing5 wrote:


I am unsure as to what you are saying. are u saying that god can only take us "so far" in recovery or that religion can only take us "so far" to prevent us from acting out?

.

Keepclimbing5 wrote:



true true, and i never said that the connection with Hashem is the cure-all to addiction problems. what i said was the underlying theme of the WHY i should recover, for me is a reglious matter.
that being said, of course it recommended to use sensible recovery tools such as 12 steps, or many of the other options gye has so nicely made available.
in fact, i honestly doubt if it is possible to recover without the right tools. remember, there is a setup why the addict fell to addiction in the first place, and simply "deciding" to work on his spirituality more, i don't think will work.
but if one uses the right tools AND in my case, makes the cause a religious one, it may increase chances of success.
i love you all

I think we should make your signature sticky!!!

Ditto to you!

lavi wrote:


i think that connection to my higher power is what keeps me sober, and nothing else. granted the 12 steps pave the way for connection. dr. carl jung said in terms of AA that "spirituality fixes addiction" or something to that extent.

Hashem is the center of our lives - being a person (as opposed to an addict) means restoring ourselves to become in His Image - recovery is done in His Presence (as the fall was in His Presence) - our motivation is to reconnect with Him

If Ahavat and Yirat Hashem - Dveikut BaShem is the focus of life, how could that not be the focus of recovery?

But if a person, G-d forbid, clicks out and forgets all of the above, or drops back into some old habit he gained in some wrong exit of life? He better click back fast, catch himself (get into a framework where he'll have a supportive community to help him not fall). He must a safety net built into his being that is human, not just religious.

There are ideas here which are extremely compelling and not necessarily religious & can create a safety net when our religious defenses are down -
I don't want to ruin my intimate life with my spouse,
I don't want to mess up my relationship with my kids,
I don't want to be ois mench,
I don't want to get caught by some colleague, IT professional, or the police
What did RYBZ say? "When a person sins he says, 'No person should see me'"
I don't want to be embarrassed of myself, a sneaky and disgusting luster

I do want to give nachas to my Creator
I want to live a life of truth and connectedness
I want to relate to people as G-d's creations
I want to serve Hashem with joy

cordnoy wrote:


cordnoy is right on the money. Recovery means connection to Hashem. It may not have the wrappings and trappings of our classic yeshiva education but it is right in line with the essence of emunah and bitachon.

Also lavi writes"the idea of serenity/stability/recovery, being the most important thing in the world, doesn't work for me. i need it to be a religious issue, or it doesn't matter so much to me. life is only as valueable as my connection with Hashem."

How in the world can we live and be successful in gasmius or ruchnuis if lust is in control? Sobriety is the the aleph-beis of life. As cordnoy stated before if life is unmanageable the in essence there is no life. We have become the walking dead. Haven't we all, by our efforts in recovery, connected to Hashem in a way we never had before. For me the raw honesty, the working on humility, the helping of others...
Whatever I was before I am certainly better today in untold ways because of this "idea of serenity/stability/recovery" that you so flippantly refer to.

The ladder to ruchnius is staring you in the face and you are ignoring it because of its
odd(goyish) looking packaging".

"Al tistakel bakankan..."

Markz can you tell us more about ,

"why be nervous? Just write how you feel. It's the best thing I've ever done in my life, period"

Writing down your feelings ? How does that work ?

Newaction

This was coined by "Sci1977" on this page HERE last spotted on the forums on June 2 2011, though he racked up almost 900 post before the smartphone day
If you need more info give him a call

1- As an aspie writing my feelings can be a challenge
2- My signature is not for me, but for the visitor / friend / gabai, to encourage posting as much as possible
3- Perhaps you're the first guy to read my signature? I'm happy someone did

thank you chevra for responding, i am grateful for the feedback.



Shlomo24 wrote:


not sure i understand your position. connection to a higher power, let's say is defined as davening,learning,mitzvos,[meditating?]. are you saying that none of the other tools work for you? but you "grant" 12 steps? to pave the way? and taphsic method, sa, 90 days etc... are useless for you? maybe you should "grant" the forums as well, after all you are posting here?
at least you can understand the others who have been helped by different methods.

yirashamayim,

cordnoy wrote:
lavi, the white book talks all about the connection to God with which we are missin'
recovery is about findin' Him again.
Addiction is lookin' for that union.

but we were lookin' for love in all the wrong places.

bhatzlachah


cordnoy is right on the money. Recovery means connection to Hashem. It may not have the wrappings and trappings of our classic yeshiva education but it is right in line with the essence of emunah and bitachon.

Also lavi writes"the idea of serenity/stability/recovery, being the most important thing in the world, doesn't work for me. i need it to be a religious issue, or it doesn't matter so much to me. life is only as valueable as my connection with Hashem."

How in the world can we live and be successful in gasmius or ruchnuis if lust is in control? Sobriety is the the aleph-beis of life. As cordnoy stated before if life is unmanageable the in essence there is no life. We have become the walking dead. Haven't we all, by our efforts in recovery, connected to Hashem in a way we never had before. For me the raw honesty, the working on humility, the helping of others...
Whatever I was before I am certainly better today in untold ways because of this "idea of serenity/stability/recovery" that you so flippantly refer to.

The ladder to ruchnius is staring you in the face and you are ignoring it because of its
odd(goyish) looking packaging".

"Al tistakel bakankan..." עכ'ל

lavi responds:


for your info, the reason why i was being careful when i wrote my post, is that a long time ago there was a big discussion on this very point. should we recover for religious reasons or not, and most off the chevra then said, they felt it would be better not to. in fact our dear friend cordnoy, was among them. if he has changed his mind, or simply quoting a different view from the white book, remains to be seen.
please note i never implied that recovery cannot help spirituality , rather the point was:
should religion be our underlying reason for recovery. is "life" the main goal or religion?

if one sees all methods of recovery as religious steps, i think it is great. what i "flippantly" flipped was the other side of the coin, that there are others that don't see it that way, that means they find it counterproductive to view recovery in a religious way.