I just joined. I’m a “top” bachur in a good yeshiva (at least that’s what people think…) and really want to commit to change so I can live up to What i want to become. I struggle tremendously and hope that This will be my last stop in a long journey.

You are top! Someone who has the mindfulness to see where he can improve is top in my mind. You came to a great place. Good luck on your journey! 

Welcome! Please check out these great free resources: 
ebook- The Battle of the Generation 
Audio series- The Fight
They're very good to start with.
See below in my signature for the links.

​Hatzlocha!

It’s great that you are dealing with this now when you are young. I wish I would have had all these tools available when I was in yeshiva. Keep us posted on what works for you and don’t be embarrassed to ask for help. We all know how difficult this can be.

Face the challenge wrote on 04 Apr 2022 07:17:

Some people might THINK that you're "top". 
But we KNOW that you're "top".
The true mindset that we instill here on GYE is that Hashem created us with perfect imperfections. As long as we try to go on the direction of self improvement, we're already considered from the TOP people in the world and eventually we'll achieve things that we didn't dream it can be possible.  

I would also advise that you take a look in the attached booklet. This letter (booklet) was written by a typical good Yeshiva Bochur learning in a typical Yeshiva. He had the same struggles as everyone else and Baruch Hashem has succeeded to grow through them and move on. In this important letter, he wanted to share with other Bochurim what he learned from his journey, to encourage them and share that they are not alone! He guides his peers to the right perspective and suggests a few simple tools, encouraging and ensuring them that they too can see tremendous Siyata Deshmaya and overcome this difficult struggle.

Although GYE has many eBooks and resources that deal with this topic, this particular letter is important because it is coming from one bochur to another, as opposed to being written by a mechanech or therapist who is coming from a different place.

Welcome Face the challenge! You have arrived at the right place.
Your remark that you a top bachur is actually not at all surprising to me. I would bet that many top bochrim struggle immensely in this battle because the כח to fantasize and lust is very related to the כח to be מחדש חידושי תורה. I mean that the same type of guy who can succeed in getting a complex sugya in his head with all the tosfos and loves doing so, is the same type of guy who has a much easier time time filling his head with lustful garbage and imagery. This is not just a coincidence. Speaking from personal experiences as someone who was also a top bachur and still shteigs a lot, I feel that they are very related. That is, I not only know that Chazal tell me they are related, I actually have witnessed and felt their connection in my own life. The more you use your intellectual gifts to focus on learning and simply move on from fantasizing, you will see that the taivos begin to evaporate. (See my signature below, as that was the advice that saved my life when I got to this site). So keep shteiging away and posting on this site!!! I have made it to 206 days clean and counting, Baruch Hashem, using this site, and up until the day I joined this site I thought I was so the only one with a huge yetzer hara in the midst of an endless, life ruining battle. I didn't even believe that people could honestly be clean for 30 days, let alone 90 days. I thought for sure that I'd go to the grave still struggling with הוצאת זרע לבטלה.
In sum, there is DEFINITELY a way out. It starts here on GYE. Looking forward to more of your posts! Sorry for the long post.

5Uu80*cdwB#^ wrote on 04 Apr 2022 17:51:

Can you elaborate please on your feelin's and that which you know from Chazal? Top bachurim struggle more/less? It's easier for them to fall into this pit/harder? They can escape this type of behavior faster/slower?

Sure. From personal experience alone, I posit that top learners, for the most part, have very vivid imaginations, which leads them to also have commensurately stronger nisyonos in the arena of fantasies about women. I know there are many variables at play. I am just positing that this is one of many important variables. It's not based on any studies, so maybe I'm completely wrong. I'd be fine if I was proven wrong.

Regarding what I meant to say when I mentioned Chazal (I'm sorry if this wasn't so clear, but it's what I meant): I meant to say that the "yetzer hara" and Talmud Torah are definitely "related". This is most clearly spelled out in the third source I put below:

Kiddushin 30b: כָּךְ הַקָּדוֹשׁ בָּרוּךְ הוּא אָמַר לָהֶם לְיִשְׂרָאֵל בָּנַי בָּרָאתִי יֵצֶר הָרָע וּבָרָאתִי לוֹ תּוֹרָה תַּבְלִין וְאִם אַתֶּם עוֹסְקִים בַּתּוֹרָה אֵין אַתֶּם נִמְסָרִים בְּיָדוֹ שֶׁנֶּאֱמַר הֲלוֹא אִם תֵּיטִיב שְׂאֵת

Succah 52a:  אֲתָא הָהוּא סָבָא, תְּנָא לֵיהּ: כׇּל הַגָּדוֹל מֵחֲבֵירוֹ — יִצְרוֹ גָּדוֹל הֵימֶנּוּ.

Rambam Hilchos Issurei Biah Perek 22 Halacha 21:  גְּדוֹלָה מִכָּל זֹאת אָמְרוּ יַפְנֶה עַצְמוֹ וּמַחֲשַׁבְתּוֹ לְדִבְרֵי תּוֹרָה וְיַרְחִיב דַּעְתּוֹ בַּחָכְמָה שֶׁאֵין מַחְשֶׁבֶת עֲרָיוֹת מִתְגַּבֶּרֶת אֶלָּא בְּלֵב פָּנוּי מִן הַחָכְמָה. וּבַחָכְמָה הוּא אוֹמֵר (משלי ה יט) "אַיֶּלֶת אֲהָבִים וְיַעֲלַת חֵן דַּדֶּיהָ יְרַוֵּךָ בְכָל עֵת בְּאַהֲבָתָהּ תִּשְׁגֶּה תָמִיד":

A late welcome Face the Challenge!
I am also a "top bochur" and I also felt that these challenges meant I wasn't top. The main thing to realize is that even with these challenges, and falls you are still an amazing person, and Hashem loves you more than you can imagine! Keep strong!

5Uu80*cdwB#^ wrote on 04 Apr 2022 19:16:

Thank you.
The first paragraph and your positin', I will not spend time on, for it seems to me conjecture at most and perhaps a bit of self-justification at its worst.

Regardin' the Torah business, and combined with your initial post, this creates a very murky thesis. Source #1 - if you have a yetzer hara, study Torah - end of discussion. this contradicts your posits about Torah study cretaes porn fantasies. It does shtim with source #3 that if you're not learnin' you're doomed (but accordin' to your thesis, if you're a good learner, you got wild sex parties mergin' with the Rashba and Pnei Yehoshua). Now, source #2 sort of runs parallel with your thesis, but for different reasonin;. Your conjecturin' was that delvin' Torah thoughts creates opportunity for dark secretive sexual fantasies, and the source just maintains that one who is greater has a stronger yetzer. And, of course, it's kinda the opposite of #1 and #3, for if you engaged in Torah study, the yetzer hara doesn't even mess with you.

So, my friend, let's continue this friendly banter please and see if we can come out with somethin' clear.

Thank you and Godspeed!

cordnoy wrote on 04 Apr 2022 19:48:

I think there is a chiluk here between the koach to learn - the ability and power of torah in a person - so you either have wild sex parties, or a pnei yehoshua. I agree that #1 is not so relevant, but #2 is definitely a little mashma the thesis, and 3 is exactly the thesis no? that one who is able to learn, will have greater challenges in this area?

strugglingWithMyself wrote on 04 Apr 2022 19:59:

Nope; not in the slightest. #2 is not referrin' to Torah exclusively, and #3 is if anythin' the opposite - just learn and you will be saved, don't learn and you're doomed; the thesis/conjecture was positin' that it's the learnin' that brings on the fantasizin'. Now, if you wanna answer that it's the deep learnin' that brings it on, but only when you're not actively learnin', that's fine, but true even if a fellow can't learn a lick, for if his mind is blank, he will revert to sex parties.

Ha. I misread בְּלֵב פָּנוּי מִן הַחָכְמָה as meaning "Open to wisdom" rather than "Turned away from Wisdom"
I still think that the point is true - that someone who is intelligent has a powerful "Dimyon," which can allow for more fantasizing - but this is just guessing, not sourced.

cordnoy wrote on 04 Apr 2022 20:13:

Hey cordnoy. I think I was very misunderstood. I was certainly never trying to say that learning Torah creates fantasies. I also was to certainly never trying to posit that learning brings on fantasizing. I don't know where you read that from my words. The absolute opposite is true. Learning will take your mind away from fantasies as is clear in the sources I quoted. I was trying to posit that someone who has was gifted a brain that is able to learn very well likely has a brain that is extremely capable of fantasizing and therefore will face big challenges in the areas of lust.

Anyway, I appreciate the discussion. I just do not think I was בכלל understood as intended.

Also, cordnoy, I want to say thank you for something else, because I think it was one of your old posts I saw when I started my journey 206 days ago about the damage that lusting in the mind can have on a person even if he's not looking at anything inappropriate. That post saved my life. So, if that was your post, thank you!

5Uu80*cdwB#^ wrote on 04 Apr 2022 22:11:

My pleasure.

None of the three sources you quoted says anythin' about gifted minds havin' the amazin' capability of fantasizin'.