First post I have seen from serenity since...
A rush of positive emotion came over me like a breathe of fresh air.

How sorely were you missed

What's the problem and what's the solution? In my experience I was (am) the problem. It wasn't the cell phone, internet, image, person, situation, acting out .... etc.  It became apparent to me, by the chesed of Hashem, that in fact my acting out was my solution and not my problem. Part of my sickness is that I was unable to see that. I was pouring water on a grease fire and couldn't understand why my house was up in flames. After all doesn't water put out fires? 

I seem to notice a lot of talk about the problem and little about the solution. Than again that could just by my warped perception. The interesting part is that I don't see a lot of talk about for me what is the real problem.

 

What I wrote sounds like a bunch of baloney to me. Since it's my thread I'll leave it up there anyway. 

serenity wrote on 15 Dec 2014 09:55:

Great post.

One of my favorite thoughts/quotes/sayings/valedictions

"Take care of you." 

Glad YOU are here!!!

A favorite Rabbi Avigdor Miller saying was
The prestigious lineage of Noach was Noach himself

It seems that one of the biggest underlying themes here is cause and effect. This causes me to do that and that caused me to do this and if I do that I won't do this and what can I do to stop doing that. It sounds like a very tiring ordeal to me. It reminds me that not too long ago and for the 40 plus years prior I was dealing with and fighting with causes and effects. I often stray back into that territory and I need to remind myself that I don't have the strength to deal with it anymore. 

My sponsor is very into that. He says that nothing rationally causes me to lust. My diseased brain says that resorting to lust is a good idea. 

Great stuff! I believe that in sobriety as well any worthwhile long range plan for successful living you got to break things down to the fundamentals and stay loyal to it. Sure you can study the ideas behind the behavior and there is lots of value to that
But when it comes to practical application that is day to day living.: Remember this:
KISS     Keep It Simple Stupid

Guilt is a bad feeling because I know I did something wrong. For example I feel bad because I went to the casino and lied to my wife about it. Or, I feel bad because I drank 4 shots at the kiddush and told my wife I only had 1.  I can feel bad because I think the act was wrong (the lying, the drinking and/or the gambling). I can also feel bad because I feel like I failed which can be ego driven. I can feel sincerely bad I hurt my wife. I can also feel bad because I'm afraid of rejection. I think that maybe when i feel bad after masturbating it's because I now think God will reject me and I will suffer consequences. That may be why I don't want to put on tefillin later. I feel rejected and I'm afraid to face Hashem and receive the consequences.  These are self serving motives, I believe and they never helped me to get better, only worse.  When father and a son have a close bond and open communication, the son after wronging the father can come come to him without fear and shame and seek guidance love and forgiveness.  There may be consequences if the son needs them for his well being and there may not be. I used to get angry at my son and punish him all the time. It never helped anything. As I found sobriety from alcohol and  eventually from lust our relationship improved and so did his actions and life. What changed in me is that I became there for him for his sake and made a constant effort to separate my ego from our relationship.

Time to daven. Hatzlacha Chevra! I'll check for typos later I"YH

If I were to post that I give up on sobriety and recovery and I'm leaving here, I think I would get a ton of encouragement and people trying to convince me to stay.  A few of years ago that is where I was. I had given up on ever being able to change and stop my acting out. I had decided to end the guilt and the battle with myself.  All the encouragement in the world would have done nothing to convince me otherwise. I believe that was the beginning of my recovery. It was perhaps the final shattering of any belief in self, of any ego that would allow me to think I could control this disease. It was an end to the guilt and it was allowed me to eventually get well. 

Some people come back here (and other groups) after a long absence, defeated and dejected and sick of the battle. Then they get get back on their feet here and recharged and ready for the next spree. It's often like a maintenance program. Come to a program before my life gets too unmanageable, get fixed back up again and then go back out. I know this all to well. I was doing this for 40 years. I would get better long enough to forget the pain and then go back out again. For me I had to give up and let myself fall to bottom to a point where I can't handle going back again. For you, maybe you can give up and just go after recovery like a life raft. There is no need to fall further, but there may be a need to give up and cling to the help that is here for you.

I'm afraid some of this will be misunderstood. I'm not sure I understand it myself. But, it's what's on my my mind, it's what I need to say and it's my share. 

Have a good Shabboss. 

serenity wrote on 16 Sep 2016 22:52:

I relate to that, but I think in a different way--recovery in a way seems to breed sickness. If I'm about to m*sturbate and I write a big SOS, I'll get tons of responses and support.  If I write about the humdrum recovery in every-day life, little successes and little struggles, or if there is some finer point I am struggling with or confused about, nobody really seems to give much of a hoot.

Newleaf354 wrote on 18 Sep 2016 13:02:


For sure. Because it is really hard to live in a consistently normal and healthy way- who has the energy for that, and who has the energy to support that? But occasional boosts and pushes seem so much easier.

The point you bring out is at the crux of the beginning of recovery for many of us. At a certain point it becomes to hard for us to keep acting out, lying, covering our trail, hiding, cheating and living a double life, etc. It becomes easier to live in a healthy way and put our energy into that. I got to the point where  had no energy to constantly live a double life. Which brings me back to my original point. If I help someone to get a reprieve just so they can go back to acting again after they have rested enough, am I really helping them.  Sometimes an addict has to fall on his face, before he really start to get better.

One of my short comings is that when a guy comes back on here with his stories about all the ways he acted out during his absence, what women he was flirting with, how close he came to the big thrill, and now he wants his big welcome back so he can make himself feel better (and rest up for the next exploit), I just want to vomit.  And I think that since I myself was in his position and even worse, I can tell him that. However I'll try to be somewhat of a mentsch and do on my thread where I feel (rightly or wrongly) that I have more license to express myself. 

On the other hand when I hear a guy (an addict) say "I give up on recovery" (and also not brag about his exploits) it gives me hope that he is starting recovery. Because he (I'm talking about addicts) has finally realized that he can't do it. 

I do everything I can for recovery, but I know it isn't me keeping me sober. 

Newleaf354 wrote on 18 Sep 2016 13:02:

Then it's time to start living for yourself. And there are many ways to do that. I learned to treat myself in recovery. To take is slow and simple. If you see, I don't post about my personal life much anymore on this forum. I have real people that I can reach out to and I have God and myself. I really relate, because I've definitely been where you have been. I used to write my mundane posts in exciting or exaggerated ways so I would get the thank you's and the karma and the replies. It was a step into being more honest, but it wasn't ideal. I needed to go little by little and eventually I got there. Maybe try something like that. The worst thing you could do is beat yourself up though. "Progress not perfection." 

Hatzlacha Rabah.