Good to hear of your committment, and your success.

Shteig on bro!

Avraham613 wrote on 03 Jul 2012 00:08:


Congrats on the breakthough!
It's an amazing feeling coming out of the closet, isn't it?

Ha - interesting way to put it but yea.

i like how in your first post you put the word "addiction" in quotations.

if you are really addicted (lashon #1), or an addict (lashon #2), that's okay!
in the vast realm of recovery experts, there is dispute about whether it is better for us to say "i am an addict" (12 step facilitation view) and to strongly identify yourself with the diease model of addiction, or to say "i am charlie brown, and i have an addiction (he used cocaine heavily after snoopie died). both ways have pros, cons, twists and turns, and each person must make the right mixture for himself with his sponsor or therapist.

the main thing is to be happy with how God made you and to appreciate the individual challenge and tafkid he gave you.
i see your'e doing well, i just wanted to clarify that.
ac999

Chevra -
Unfortunately, I had a bad fall last night. I was doing well and took positive steps I never have before in my life. But last night I fell probably worse than I have before in my life as well.
I am taking the fall somewhat with the proper perspective of trying to stay positive and get right back on track. But I'm not gunna lie, I am still kinda depressed about it.
I am wondering if these steps that I have taken and the progress I've made (regarding making my recovery real and a priority) is directly related to the degree in which I fell. Maybe the Y"H is working extra hard because he knows I am finally going in the right direction. Maybe I am putting too much focus on my struggles that it is now always on my mind, causing me to act out worse than before.
Is this normal?
I read a recent chizuk email where Dov describes how he tries not to think about his addiction too much. The less attention we give it, the less it will effect us.
Maybe I am putting too much time and thought into this. I'm a little confused.
Anyway.... thanks again.
Avraham

Thank you Avraham for speaking up, I see i'm not the only one with such thoughts. I found it interesting too that since I started posting on the forum about 2 weeks ago I fell 3 times (today being the 3rd). In the past I made till 70 days clean now I find I don't go by 5-6 days without a fall.
I'd appreciate the responses this would bring from the pros out there.

I try to "keep climbing"

Well, I'm not a pro, but here's my two cents.
Starting the day I joined the forum, I spent about two months without breaking a week. Previously, even a moderate effort gained me at least two weeks (and as much as two months), not that I did it too often.
So I can relate to the fact that my efforts and focus in this area have been causing me to fall earlier.
By the way, I'm currently 10 days clean- longer than I've done since my first visit here. But I don't feel like it's a big deal. It's simply a result of the work I've been doing in all areas of my life, which is essentially what the 12 steps accomplish over time. Even with my falls, I felt my progress over time- and I still do. It helped, of course, that Mottel kept asking me what I would do differently every time I reported my fall.
Nu. (That's Dov's line.) Don't obsess too much about the fall itself. Try to see where you've made progress, and what needs more work. See if you can avoid the slips that lead to your fall, specifically. But most importantly, move on. Keep going. And in the shprach, KOT!

Hatzlacha, and call me!
Meir

I just feel like all of the sudden every second of my day revolves around this specific aspect of my life. It was never like that before.
I don't necessarily relate it completely to my increased involvement on GYE, but I'm just nervous.
My fall last night was pretty bad. I texted a few guys immediately after it happened which I have never done before.
I'm just confused/frustrated.

try texting, actually calling 10 people who answer the call BEFORE you act out, texting people after is good, and you get a pat on the back. so now call a few live people before you decide to act on anything silly. THAT is the next step.


pardon me for asking but.....from whereth does thou get access to porn, or chat rooms, or whatever it is that you struggle with?

is it dad's pc and he won't get a filter? is it your pc and you deep down dont want a filter? do you have a filter like k9 but know the password? do you send your webchaver to hugh hefner so it gives no accountability? is the pc even the problem? is it coming from looking out the window at night at the chasuna hall and all the people standing outside?


whare do you seem to get an enviroment of lust material from? please explain

The idea is to reach out before. ...
Keep moving forward.
Mottel

Avraham613 wrote on 05 Jul 2012 02:23:


Of course it can be related to your involvement with GYE! The problem we have is obviously increased when we keep thinking about it all the time. It does not matter that much if we are thinking about naked people - or about not thinking about naked people...either way, we are walking around thinking about naked people all the time!

In the program we call that 'living in the problem, instead of in the solution'. The problem is fighting and struggling against lust. The soultion is surrender. Giving up the fight...unless you are really winning. But it does not see you are, if you are seeing that you are doing worse, right?

'Let go and let G-d' sounds like chinese, at first. But really, the wages of struggling, are just focusing on it even more. And that is just another way to lose, actually

Success in letting go takes time, takes practice, and takes connection with others who are actually doing it successfully. I have not met people who have learned how to do it from a book.

Get me? You can do this, as long as you realize that you can't.

If you are an addict (which I am not saying you are, just sharing this idea - you take it or leave it as you see fit.)

AC999 -
Yes, I do have a filter and I have 2 accountability partners (one of them being my wife) through WebChaver.
I deleted the browser off my blackberry almost 2 years ago.
I don't have any other access porn on the computer. That being said, when all that is cut off, we tend to look for other ways to fill in the gap. This was my problem.

Dov - I realize that I need to let go and let Hashem take over the fight for me. I daven daily that even though I have no idea what the heck that means He should do it for me anyway. My qyestion is, practically, what is there to do in order to instill that mindset? What should I actually be doing in order to surrender the fight to Hashem?

Thanks again for the chizuk.
Avraham

Avraham613 wrote on 06 Jul 2012 14:13:
The concrete things begin with exactly what AC999 mentioned. Taking action to get rid of our hidden bottles. You have done a lot of that already. Admitting the truth about ourselves to real people - this forum is great, but not nearly enough for many. Real talk - at least on the phone - using our real voice and our real first name...preferably face to face using our real faces...that is more.

Davening for the women we lust after when we see them, instead of struggling with the 'fight' is another big action to take. The fighting and 'overcoming' are lusts - egotistical spiritual lusts. The egotism needs to go...slowly, even more than the lust does. Much more, actually.

Laughing at the irony and silliness of our 'big' challenges is also is a major thing. It should be funny that a voluptuous woman just jogged by - not a major calamity and spiritual challenge. "Gevalt...funny - of all people for her to wiggle by, He chose me! Hashem's sense of humor!" and I can laugh about it. Thank G-d. Even my wife laughs about it the same way when we are somewhere and someone walks by ridiculously pritzusdikly :o 8) :'( - the wife and I look at each other and laugh! Not at the person - she probably does not know any better. We laugh at the irony of me - a recovering pervert - being here now... That's far, far better than the old, sick way: giving this oblivious girl the power of turning her into some kind of she-witch with awesome powers of "lustifying me". Gevalt, I wanna hurl. Yeah, of course I am powerless and nuts over lust - I cannot control and enjoy it! But we give this particular woman that power by our struggling and making a big stink about it/her. She is doing her job in G-d's Will somehow we can't understand - and we do ours. That's it. Kind of funny, really...

Avraham613 wrote on 06 Jul 2012 14:13:

Fixed. We all deal with this.
And Dov, thanks for that.

Dov-
Shkoyach for your powerful words once again.
I had a great shabbos and little struggle.

Im nervous that if I go on a great clean streak now it's really only because of the disgust I felt after my fall. Like, I would never be able to go on this streak if I wasn't for what I did last week. This happened to me once right before my biggest streak (this year). I fell really hard and then stayed completely clean for about 4 months (until my most recent struggles) .
Maybe this time around will be different now that I have different tools to use......I hope.

Avraham