a few days ago i came across this fabulous site and i decided to start again.
i am for 12 years fighting in this battle and realy hope that this time i will win.

for some years now i am in and out from it- before rosh hashana i was clean for almost a year  : but then all the feelings around tshuva got me thinking about all the garbage again and got me in until last week(look at the 90 day chart)  :-[ :-[. i think that the thing that is most hard for me is the thought that it is a battle for life, i don't want to be in tension all the time. the only thing this time that is different is that with encourage from the help guy here i got the courage to go to the rabbi of my kehila and talk to him about it and start sending him webchaver reports.
one of my problems is i have the net through work so i don't have a filter :-[ :-[.
would like to be in contact maybe here i will get chizuk.
thank you all
------------------------
כֻּלָּנוּ גֻּיַּסְנוּ לְכָל הַחַיִּים,
מִשּׁוּרָה מְשַׁחְרֵר רַק הַמָּוֶת.

last try(hope) wrote on 05 Dec 2011 20:55:


Well last try.  I agree with you that the thought of stopping for the rest of your life to do something you may have been doing for a long time can be very frightening indeed.  But how about just focusing on today.  Certainly, you would agree that you can stop for one day.  Well that's all you need to aim for today.  Why worry about tomorrow when you have no guarantee that you'll even be around tomorrow, and that if you are that you will have any interest in looking at porn or whatever else you are struggling with.  Today is real and today you can keep clean.
Even if you are taking it one day at a time, depending on how you approach it, it can still be a tense experience.  You may want to work on establishing a relationship with Hashem, certainly He can remove the tension.  Stick around here, you'll learn how to do it.  But for now welcome and hatzlacha and enjoy the rest of your sober day.

last try(hope) wrote on 05 Dec 2011 20:55:


Wow. Do you think that thinking about teshuva depresses you, and makes you give up, at which point you figure you may as well be in for a dime as in for a dollar?

last try(hope) wrote on 05 Dec 2011 20:55:
Well, if your attitude is that winning is permanent, then it is no wonder that you are rightly concerned about permanent tension. You can't have your cake and eat it, too: you cannot take credit for the victory and at the same time find peace in the loving help of Hashem. Either He gets the credit for your clean day today, not you - and you leave tomorrow to Him, too...or you take credit for fighting and winning today, and all the future "todays" are your responsibility, too. 

I have been taught (by sober addicts) how to depend on G-d - but that necessarily also means giving Him the credit and not pretending it was my victory. Either I have the power, or I do not, is what works for me, be"H.



So you discovered that opening up to another real person (not just virtual [fake] names like most people use on this forum) helps you a lot - It's Captain Kirk to the rescue!

last try(hope) wrote:

as i was saying the problem is the tension. when i asked here what is the definition for addiction i was told that 1 of the signs is if it ruins my life. what i feel is that it maybe ruins my 'olam haba' but fighting it ruins me now. i know i can stop- i was clean for almost a year - but every day in that time i was full with thinking about how to be careful not to fall, this was putting me under a lot of pressure. i want to stop wanting to sin, have not made success that way.
another problem i have on my way up is that things that ordinary people have no problem doing get me down, like if my wife wants that i will come with her to the mall you know there are huge pictures that i shouldn't see but i can't get away from going.
i would be happy to hear ideas what should i do.
thank you all for the time you are investing reading my posts

last try(hope) wrote on 06 Dec 2011 22:54:


If the only reason that you are fighting it is because you will lose your olam haba, you are going to have a very hard time fighting this addiction succesfully.  Why not think about how your addiction affects you in the here and now.

i didn't express my self so well. i feel addiction isn't grate at all but the fight is no fun either.

it does ruin my life by making me be less of a person when i enslave to my desires that i realy feel (only when i try stoping i look for it alot , usualy i only go to it when i am depressed) , but maybe it is not enough to make me stop.

i don't look at porn i look at stuff that is hung up on every billboard where i live, so even when i am clean i feel still in it.
need ideas
thanks

dov wrote on 06 Dec 2011 12:50:

Here's the link to the captain kirk reference. www.guardyoureyes.org/forum/index.php?topic=4109.msg111973#msg111973 . dov, i think you should put this link in your signiture.

I find 2 isssues 1) the fight 2)wanting the shmutz
for me whenever I feel it's a fight I try to remind myself this addiction is stronger than me and I need Hashems help. I feel that on one hand maybe I'm weak but on the otherhand I'm admitting my faults aknowlaging my limits which in truth takes strength.

as for the wanting it, thats how I trained myself to feel good is from looking at shmutz. It's slow to change to focus on what you realy need to feel good. The addiction itself does't want to let you feel good in any other way. such as i have done this or that. or that Hashem made me i'm important just for myself. It is the positive attitude towards ourself that will stop us from looking around to feel good but this takes time.
I don't worry about the fight as much as what will make me feel good and happy.

Dear last try
Two key things jump to mind

1. The fear that the battle is forever - If you worry about this you will never succeed.  let me clarify - of course as everyone on the forum will tell you once you are into shmutz it will always be a temptation and you need to work on yourself every day to avoid it BUT and this is the important part
YOU NEED TO CHANGE YOUR OUTLOOK - REPLACE THE BAD with the GOOD - i.e. the more you get serious about having a real relationship with Hashem and being honest with yourself and with HIM and deciding that you want to be clean because being clean is the true good and the goal and the purpose in life  AS OPPOSED TO I am being good because I am afraid of punishment - worried about loosing olam haba etc... The reason the Rambam tells us not to focus on Olam habah is because it is unproductive - sure we all want to be close to the Ribbno Shel Olam in Olam Haemes BUT we have to change ourselves in this world - with its challenges - now so that olam habah is enjoyable and worthwhile

Try to move away from the image of Hashem counting good points and being worried about loosing points for negative behavior and try to focus on being close to hashem and following his direction because it is the ultimate source of good and pleasure in this world and i olam habah

2. Its true that in the mall and many other places we are surrounded by triggers and negative images- its ok to avoid them as much as possible - especially when your feeling down and weak you need to avoid triggers - just like an alcholic avoids bars more than everyone else - we need to avoid being in problematic situations - its ok to limit yourself - no one needs to know why you are doing it

Remember the more positive experiences ( learing , davening , chesed) you do the less you will feel the struggle and the tension
Go for the good - cling to the Ribbno shel olam
smile - you'll be surprised how far a little simcha goes
good luck

  I found this to be so true. When I would "worry" about it, the worry of course would cause more pain, and the pain would call for more lust medication in order to ease the pain.

  So, I tried a different approach which I liked much more. Not to worry about it or even to "think" about it. I wanted to "forget"  about it and completely.  This too did not work for my addiction would not forget about "me".

  So, I knew that I had no choice but to "accept" the fact that I have to think about my addiction every day. Because, if "I" am doing the thinking  (not worry) about it, this reminds me that I genuinely want to be sober. I am thinking about how to remain sober...just for today, and not thinking about the "forever" part. If I choose to think about it in terms of forever, then I will become overwhelmed and drop into lust oblivion.  The "forever" can only be a by product of my "just for today" thinking. And, when someone says that they are sober for 26 years......."one day at a time"!!!!  The sobriety only came because of the "one day at a time".  If I forget that I am ONLY maintaining my sobriety "just for today", and I began to think of a larger picture, such as I am now working on my life time i.e. long term sobriety......for me it will be just a matter of time! This is when the lust comes in and says, you'll never be able to do it. "You know you will fall".....eventually you will weaken. But, with the "just for today", I can remain sober no matter what.......

last try(hope) wrote on 06 Dec 2011 23:56:


Hello LastTry(hope) and welcome.
I note that you have been clean for a year in the past, but even after a year you still found staying clean very stressful.  Then you describe falling because the teshuva process actually got you thinking about sinning, so you did.

Your quote above holds the key to success with much less stress.  It is truly amazing that you were able to hold back from full-blown acting out while not really guarding your eyes all that well.  This gazing might be benign for someone normal, but for a lust addict it's literally poison.  It triggers the release of the neurochemical that we crave.  It's like an alcoholic taking a sip of low-alcohol wine.  The problem is that this sipping maintains the addiction and prevents us from going into recovery.

On the other hand, extreme shmiras eynayim (also including movies and TV), and guarding our minds from fantasy (with tefilah) cuts off the drug cold.  The withdrawal can be downright miserable, but then it passes.  Like a smoker who quit, the cravings lighten until they're almost gone.  Until he smells someone's smoke and has to get away.

So go all the way with your shmiras eynayim.  I don't even check out my own wife unless it's the appropriate setting.  It's easier than constantly fighting the urges.

On to another area...
If you have unrestricted, unmonitored access at work (I do), then you will need to keep away from the computer unless you're working or checking email or GYE.  Don't linger on the computer, surfing mindlessly.  That's the Y"H hoping to get a peek and drive you over the edge.  If you must go to mainstream websites, cover any pics of women with your hand and get away quick.  Finished what you have to do? Hit the red X and step away from the computer.  Turn off the screen.

And like UAJ said, take it one day at a time, one nisayon at a time.  One right decision at a time.

This time will be different. Hatzlocha!

Alex

alexeliezer wrote on 07 Dec 2011 19:44:

i know  i know i know it is all about 'shmiras eynayim' but that is the big problem. i don't know how i could do very good on it. i work with people that think they need to come to work as if it were the beach. that is part of why i am stressed from it, it is like working in a brewery >.
another thing is like happend today, my wife wanted me to see with her a movie. she doesn't belive that seeing a few women dressed non modestly could realy do me grate damage, i think she was offended when i refused. have a few more examples that maybe i will talk about afterwards.
so again about the 'shmiras eynayim' i decided to 'lekabel al atzmi' not to go into non kosher news sites (like google news etc. that are full of garbage the sort i am afraid of) and if i will go in purposely this week i will  give gye 19$.
please some one ask me some time from now how am i doing because i realy like reading news..
about a filter i am a bit lying to myself. i have at home internet from work (at work i don't play around) but i don't have to have it, i am afraid to talk to my wife about it.
thanks all
LT

Hey LT, I don't remember if you mentioned what your wife knows about your struggle.  So, what does she know?  Women are usually pretty clueless about it.  It's not a simple parsha.

Without telling your wife your whole struggle, you can just tell her that you've made a personal commitment to work on your shmiras eynayim, and movies just don't fit to what you're trying to accomplish.  Tell her she's the only woman you want to look at.

Regarding the women at work, I understand how challenging this can be.  Especially when it's people you're familiar with because you see them every day (and have already undressed them in your mind a thousand times).  It can be done.  Look at them only when you're conversing with them.  You don't have to look to see who just walked in or walked by, or is walking out.  As much as possible, position yourself so you'll see less.  Do your hishtadlus.  Hashem only gives us challenges that can be overcome.

Your very sanity depends on it.