Hello. I'm Mr. Smith. I thought I'd take a moment to say hi to the community here. I've been watching the pages here for about a month and felt ready to jump in a little bit. (I posted a bit from Shaarei Teshuvah on one of the boards yesterday too.)

My problem is not so much with the internet, though I've slipped up there a couple of times too. My problem is with actual people.  It's pretty terrifying to me, actually.  I get a tremendous surge of lust-excitement when it comes to seeing things I shouldn't.  I routinely walk by windows with my neck craned in case I might see anything exciting (even though chances are basically nil). When I walk in crowded areas, I am bombarded with thoughts of touching the girls I see. (I am extremely thankful that my lust does not extend to actual children. That is a nisayon I have B"H been spared.) A few times I have succumbed to touching them "by accident."  (I am further grateful that fear of consequences is still something which inhibits me.)  

So basically I am terrified of myself and of where this will go if left unchecked.  I have found this supportive community to be helpful. I am working hard on myself this Elul and doing a lot of davening. I have been to an SA group but didn't find it very helpful. I am hoping I can learn to manage this problem so that it does not ruin my life, which is certainly not hard to imagine. Looking forward to the continued support of everyone here.  (If anyone has a similar situation to me, I'd love to hear from you. I identify with internet addiction too, but I still feel kind of lonely in my own problem...)

I'd like to share one final thing that I saw today that impacted me (and I am trying to dwell on it more and really have it sink in.)  I recently read a news story of a man who on more than one occasion hid in the pit of an outhouse in order to get a glimpse of a woman sitting down on.  I thought to myself, "Thus far does a person go for taavah, eh?"  Isn't that all of us? Are we not willing to jump into a pit of excrement for a fleeting look at something that we will not attain, and that we know that even if we did attain it, it would not satisfy us? Truly this is an apt metaphor, I think. Maybe someone else here will get something out of it as well.

~Smith

Hi Mr. Smith,

Welcome to our community! (That was a great point about that article you read. Thanks!)

We get cries for help every day, by e-mail and on the forum. Tzuras Rabim Chatzi Nechama    Some guys struggle with this type of "fetish", some guys with another type of "fetish". The common denominator between all these different types of struggles though, is an addiction to LUST. It manifests itself in many different ways between many different people, but it all boils down to craving the "high" of lust. We created the GYE handbooks (links below) to help people learn how to break free of lust addiction, regardless of how it manifests itself. If you read these handbooks well, from beginning to end, and try to implement what you read, you will be"h find the answers within them to enable you to completely turn your life around. You're worth it.

Scientific studies have shown that it takes 90 days to change a neural thought pattern that was ingrained in the brain through addictive behaviors. Did you join the 90 day chart on-line? Sign up over here...

Also, join the daily Chizuk e-mail lists to get fresh chizuk every day, and post away on this forum. You will get tons of daily Chizuk and support. This disease can't be beat alone. It works best when you get out of isolation!

GuardYourEyes also offers various free anonymous phone conferences, where you can join a group of other frum Yidden, along with an experienced sponsor. See this page for four different options. Our conferences are taking place daily, throughout the week... This would be a tremendous step in the right direction for you and help you learn freedom from this addiction. Not only will you learn the secret of the 12-Steps - which is known to be the world's most powerful program for beating addiction having helped millions world wide, but joining the group will be another way of GETTING OUT OF ISOLATION and connecting with others who are going through what you are.

Let me tell you a little about the two GuardYourEyes handbooks. You see, until now, people with a lust addiction would often get "lost" when coming to our website, not knowing what tips and techniques to try. For example, a beginner wouldn't jump straight into therapy or 12-Step groups, while on the other hand, someone whose addiction was more advanced wouldn't be helped by the standard tips of "making fences" putting in "filters" etc... So it was essential to develop a handbook which details all the techniques and tools to dealing with this addiction in progressive order. Now with these handbooks, anyone can read through and see what steps they've tried already, and if those steps haven't worked, they can continue on through the handbook where the steps become progressively more powerful and "addiction-oriented".

And the second handbook, called the "Attitude" handbook, can also help anyone, no matter what level of addiction they may have. Often people write in to us saying that had they only known the proper outlook & attitude that we try and share on the GuardYourEyes network when they were younger, they would have never fallen into an addiction in the first place! So we hope that through this handbook, many addictions will be prevented.

The handbooks are PDF files, set up as eBooks, and they have bookmarks and hyper-links in the Index, to make them easy to navigate.

Make sure to read them, they contain a wealth of information on beating this addiction! And I'd love to hear your feedback on them...

Note: You might want to print them out to read away from the computer. Keep in mind though, that if you do this, you won't be able to click on the many web links in the articles. But you can always come back to them later. The truth is, it's anyway good to go through the whole handbook once without clicking on links, just to get an overview of all the tools available. Once you did that, you can start again from tool #1 and read each tool through more carefully, click the links and study each technique and assess whether you have tried it fully yet or not...

Right click on the links below and select "Save Link/Target As" to download the handbooks to your computer.

1) The GuardYourEyes Handbook
This Handbook details 18 suggested tools and techniques, in progressive order, beginning with the most basic and fundamental approaches to dealing with this addiction, and continuing down through increasingly earnest and powerful methods. For the first time, we can gauge our level of addiction and find the appropriate tools for our particular situation. And no matter what level our addiction may have advanced to, we will be able to find the right tools to break free in this handbook!

2) The GuardYourEyes Attitude
The Attitude Handbook details 30 basic principles to help us maintain the proper attitude and perspective on this struggle. Here are some examples: Understanding what we are up against, what it is that Hashem wants from us, how we can use this struggle for tremendous growth, how we can deal with bad thoughts, discovering how to redirect the power of our souls, understanding that every little bit counts, learning how to bounce back up after a fall, and so on and so forth...

May Hashem be with you!

Who ever wants the link to the story can write me. I just didn't want it on the forum (I'm not really sure why)  

Welcome Mr. Smith -

While everyones addition can play out in different ways - as you so aptly put it it all stems from the same SA addiction. Personally my problem was the internet.

Looking at people in the street while I am no tzaddik YET I feel a little ashamed when they reciprocate that stare -

I feel they know I am looking at them and I just feel low - The internet unfortunately does not have that problem. No one (mortals) know that I am looking when I am looking.

For you the 90 day chart may be somewhat of a challenge. What is a slip? What is a fall? You have to set guidelines and post everyday!!

It really works -

I dont mean to brag but I am telling you that my streak of 23 days so far 100% due to GYE and I would not have hit 4 without it.

Post away - you have a fan base already

Smith?
I think we know each other.
Why don't you use an anonymous name?
Aren't you afraid of people who know you seeing you on the forum.
Don't worry I wont tell your wife when i see her.
-uri

Ehhh... this is an anonymous name.

Thanks to all for your support. I think I need to read through the attitudes bit. One thing that confuses me most about this is how I'm supposed to give over the fight to Hashem. I know He can do anything, but then what is my part? And why do I feel like for everything I've done, He does not take away the lust feelings?

I had a mixed-results day.  I entered a store that for some reason was packed with girls. I was totally taken aback.  I said to myself in my head, loudly, "JUST RUN."  And I did.  But I had to get something!  So I stayed nearby for a while then went back - still girls.  I couldn't get myself to leave again.  I almost touched someone but I didn't (B"H). Then I felt really crappy. Then I got on a bus to go home and slipped up (touched someone on purpose). I definitely feel lousy about that.  I'm trying to feel good about the successes though...

Just thought I'd share. As you all know, the support is awfully helpful.  I'm going to think about the options and see what kind of interventions I need/can implement. I'm married and have not shared this with my wife yet, so it's a little restricting.  Comments and suggestions welcome.

~Smith

P.S. Here's the outhouse story for thosewho didn't get the link:

PORTLAND, Maine – A Maine man caught peering up at a girl from below an outhouse toilet seat four years ago stands accused of crawling into another pit toilet on White Mountain National Forest property in New Hampshire. A federal affidavit indicates a 49-year-old man confessed to repeating his previous act on Memorial Day.
Federal agents sought the man out after a 9-year-old boy saw him climbing out of a toilet at the Hastings Campground. Two witnesses saw him walk away from the outhouse.
Forest Service special agent William Fors wrote that the man initially said he climbed into the waste-filled pit to retrieve a T-shirt. Four years ago, he said he was retrieving his wedding ring.
Fors wrote the man eventually confessed climbing into outhouse pits on more than two occasions.

Welcome to the forum Mr. Smith.   

Mr. Smith, please excuse my hard words; but this is sexual harassment. Since this involves much more than just you alone, you are OBLIGATED to take whatever measure necessary. You can't allow other people to get hurt. In my opinion, participating in this online anonymous forum may not be enough for you to combat your addiction. I believe that you should tell your wife about your sex addiction (perhaps without going into details), and start by seeking out a therapist. A therapist can guide you through the necessary steps to gaining control and managing this disease. Doing anything less than your utmost may lead to eventualities which will destroy your life and the lives of many others. As long as you are here, we will help you. However know, that for you, GYE can not be seen as a means to an end, but instead only supplementary to a very strict offline course of action that you'll take in combating addiction.

In regard to the outhouse story, let me reflect on another story, while similar to this, the point conveyed is just the opposite: The story is a long and detailed story, but in brief (because I'm on the run); it involved two Chassidim staying in an Inn on their way to see R' Levi Yitzchok of Berditchev. While her husband was out, the innkeepers wife bolted into the room of these Chassidim and, weapon in hand forced them to commit an aveira with her. In the face of this difficult situation the Chassidim had agreed to fulfill her wishes, and only requested to use the bathroom beforehand. Happily, she allowed them access to the bathroom, which to her shock and surprise, as soon as she had let them in, they jumped right into the pit below the outhouse. Covered in dung, the Chassidim climbed out, and said - "Ok! We're ready! You can imagine how quickly the innkeepers wife lost interest in them and took on repulsion instead.

The Chassidim seized the opportunity and ran, leaving all their possessions behind. With nowhere to go, and only a short distance from the Berdichever's shul, that is where they headed. When they arrived it was just before mincha, and people were assembling in the shul getting ready to daven - only that they were waiting for their Rebbe -R' Levi Yitzchok of Berdichev - to arrive. These men, covered in human feces, and without the opportunity to clean themselves, entered the shul as is. They looked disgusting, and their odor was just unbearable! Quickly, those present had gotten angry at them for bringing this terrible odor into a shul - a place of prayer, and they had wanted to throw them out. Just as they were about to be removed from the shul, that's when the Rebbe walked in. R' Levi Yitzchok as he walked into shul breathed in deeply from his nose (savoring the smell) and as a pleasant smile spread across his face he said out loud: "Yosef HaTazdik! Ahhhh, the smell of Gan Eden!".

So now reverse your question: "Thus far does a person go to run from taavah, eh?" The answer is "YES!!" "ANYTHING!!"

Wishing you success on your journey - with the help of Hashem,

2B

Awesome story Tomim!

About the harrasment, Tomim has a point. HOWEVER, the question is, how far this "harassment" goes. Do the girls you sometimes "touch" feel it? Are they shocked, sickened, disgusted? Did they ever make a scene? You could get in very big and deep trouble very quickly, if this keeps up. One little scene and your name in the community could be ruined. PLEASE Mr. Smith, we want you to "Hit Bottom while you're still on top". Please read the handbooks...

I quote from the notes in the beginning:

Important: The first 16 tools of this Handbook are not intended for those whose behaviors may have overstepped the boundaries of the law or are causing harm to others. In such cases, please skip straight to tools #17 and #18, and seek immediate psychiatric evaluation before the next victim is claimed.

However, in your case I suspect it is not so bad. It's just a way that your addiction manifests itself. I believe that with the help of the handbooks, (perhaps using "vows" not to touch anyone besides your wife with the intention of deriving pleasure - and if you do, give yourself a big "knas"), you may find that you can break this dangerous habit.

I can't say I found your reply very helpful, Tomim. I know full well what it is I am doing, just as you do. I feel like you've said to me, "What I'm doing may be bad, but what YOU'RE doing is REALLY bad!"  Maybe that's not what you intended, but it didn't make me feel all that great.

In response to GUE, thus far I am too embarrassed to be so bold about it, thank G-d.  Nobody ever notices except me (I happen to be in Israel where if you don't get smooshed against someone on the bus, it's unusual).  So B"H I have not traumatized anybody yet. I am very aware what the psychological consequences are for people who are sexually abused. I hope I can turn this around before it gets there.

So far I haven't heard from anyone that has the same experience as me. Is there anyone out there? It would be a major source of comfort to break the loneliness...

~Smith

Many of us are in similar situations in some respects.
I also live in israel,and i am often on buses or in hitches that have a girl near me,and to be honest i dont really avoid contact like i should.i enjoy the thrill of "bumping".
But looking into windows is an invasion of privacy at a new level.
You are not worse than any of us.
I don't think that's at all what tomim was trying to say.
He was simply saying that it sounds like u have a really strong desire to be a little too contactful and it could possibly get u in trouble one day.
Keep in mind that there are people on this forum who have been sexually abused and they are very sensitive to the matter.
Most of us,whether conciously or not,are in some form emotionally causing pain to someone close to us.many of us have also pretty much used girls to satisfy our lusts (me,for example).
But the first thing we must do,before anything else,is be aware of the pain we cause others,and take a step back to heal before any more damage takes place.
Don't worry,smith.you are anything but alone.youve come to the right place.you'll be fine.
stay strong!
-uri

Mr.Smith, Tomim had some personal experience with a close family member that was abused, so he is aware of the dangers that can happen. But according to your answer, I see that it is just as I suspected. This i more common than most of us here would care to admit, you can read about it in some of the stories on our site. It is a manifestation of the addiction, It is sometimes a blessing, because the nature of how dangerous it is can sometimes shake us up to take action before we get into serious trouble.

Hi Smith, welcome to the forum. If you're talking about things like getting yourself smooshed against people on the bus, I do have a lot of experience with that. In fact because I'm aware of it, I notice when other people are doing it and it's not uncommon at all. As far as looking in to people's houses I can very much relate to that Taivoh also.

I can tell you that what works for everyone else, works for people like us too. Keep posting, read the handbooks and start living for the right reasons.




There is more than one answer to this. But I think that the main answer is that Hashem wants your whole heart. People like us have tremendous spiritual potential. Hashem wants us to realize that potential, so He will never take it away until we are ready to turn our whole heart to Him. (Even then, He won't take away the passion, He'll just help you direct it to Him) But when we do, life becomes at least a million times better than it was before.

And the more you get involved with the forum, the easier it is to get there!

CHAZAK VE'EMATZ!

Dear "mr Smith" -
I'll send you a personal message through this site.
Your desire to change is remarkable.
- Dov

I have done the accidental touching things many times. In my case it was with people in know. I can relate to the windows peeking as well > :'(.




I used to wonder the same thing. Then I dug a little deeper and realized that there was a higher level of devotion to Hashem. Maybe I will never reach that level where I can "relax", and maybe I will need the lust on the back burner to propel me to more devotion to Hashem. We all feel like we wish we could just get past the lust and go on with our lives, but maybe pushing higher and higher to be Oved Hashem with all of our heart is not a bad way to spend our lives.